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Spoiler/Speed Brake - ineffective

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  • ced ampo
    replied
    Originally posted by MCM View Post
    G'day Ced, Gaz et al.

    First of all, how much of an effect do you expect the speedbrake to have? I'd suggest there's a good chance that the speedbrakes on some of the default planes is a little more effective than it is in real life. Sure, they're good, but they don't solve everything. If you're not close to your required speed, they won't just stop you dead. Try planning your descents so you cross the gates that I've mentioned below, and you'll probably find that the speedbrake becomes a lot less necessary.

    Second, starting descent 40nm from the airport? That seems awfully close to be realistic.

    The rough approximation of 3 x Height plus a few miles as Wilco has mentioned tends to work well for most jet types - Certainly works for the 767 and the 747, and I thought the 737 as well.

    Out of interest, descent planning is definately an art, and there are some guys that are just brilliant at it. For me, I keep it pretty simple and use a few gates.

    At 40nm to touchdown, I'd be aiming to be at 10,000ft, 250kts.
    At 30nm to touchdown, roughly 8000ft 250 kts.
    At 20nm to touchdown, roughly 5000ft.
    At 10nm to touchdown, 3000ft and at an appropriate speed (say flap 5 manoeuvre speed).

    Do you do your descents with the speedbrake extended or the gear out? If you can make it in from 40nm from 30,000ft, you'd be looking at maintaining over 4000fpm RoD, and without any extra drag that isn't realistic, and I'd be thinking there might be something wrong with the model.

    I manage to do that because i like to go over the airport first, before landing, which means that I basically fly around 60-75nm before landing, and for me, it gives me enough time to descent and catch the ILS.

    Leave a comment:


  • MCM
    replied
    G'day Ced, Gaz et al.

    First of all, how much of an effect do you expect the speedbrake to have? I'd suggest there's a good chance that the speedbrakes on some of the default planes is a little more effective than it is in real life. Sure, they're good, but they don't solve everything. If you're not close to your required speed, they won't just stop you dead. Try planning your descents so you cross the gates that I've mentioned below, and you'll probably find that the speedbrake becomes a lot less necessary.

    Second, starting descent 40nm from the airport? That seems awfully close to be realistic.

    The rough approximation of 3 x Height plus a few miles as Wilco has mentioned tends to work well for most jet types - Certainly works for the 767 and the 747, and I thought the 737 as well.

    Out of interest, descent planning is definately an art, and there are some guys that are just brilliant at it. For me, I keep it pretty simple and use a few gates.

    At 40nm to touchdown, I'd be aiming to be at 10,000ft, 250kts.
    At 30nm to touchdown, roughly 8000ft 250 kts.
    At 20nm to touchdown, roughly 5000ft.
    At 10nm to touchdown, 3000ft and at an appropriate speed (say flap 5 manoeuvre speed).

    Do you do your descents with the speedbrake extended or the gear out? If you can make it in from 40nm from 30,000ft, you'd be looking at maintaining over 4000fpm RoD, and without any extra drag that isn't realistic, and I'd be thinking there might be something wrong with the model.

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Hi gazpodel,

    I don't know how to change that with the speedbrakes. But in real life you try not to use them unless necessary of course. I am flying MD11Fs for a living and I am starting the descent just a little earlier not to use them. I calculate 3 times the altitude as reference. So when at 30,000 feet I start the descent around 90 NM to touchdown. I usually add a couple of miles to have a margin for tailwind or huge pressure differences and speed reduction. So if you have 100 NM to fly until touchdown start your descent. Or use the FS ATC, they usually give you the descent at a proper point. Of course 1000 fpm rate of descent aren't enough then. Usually it is around 2000 to 3000 fpm at high altitudes and later reduces to around 1500 fpm.
    I hope that helps you a bit.

    Regards

    Leave a comment:


  • ced ampo
    replied
    I agree with RingwaySam. My rule of thumb is when descending from cruising at the low-to-mid 30,000', start your descent at about 40-50nm's from airport. I base this on flying 737-700's, which I am familiar with as I fly those with Southwest Virtual.

    Leave a comment:


  • RingwaySam
    replied
    It sounds like you're starting the descent to late. If you want to edit the spoilerons effectiveness you need a program called AirEd so you can edit the .air file.

    Leave a comment:


  • gazpodel
    started a topic Spoiler/Speed Brake - ineffective

    Spoiler/Speed Brake - ineffective

    I'm flying a321 and also B757 in FS9. When I apply the speed brakes, the plane's descent rate drops as expected but the application of the speed brakes makes no difference whatever, yet it does alot within the standard a/c that come with the game.

    Could anyone give me any guidance on what to look for within the Aircraft.cfg so I can address this problem, as it is affecting how I am going about my approaches and I think that it has been a contributing factor in that I have come-in far to fast and crashed in most of my last few approaches.

    regards,
    Gary
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