Unfair Rejection due to Bad Date

[shakermaker]

... which means a lot of accusations with no constructive input

Gerardo, are you suggesting that we link photos that have been accepted with bad data as recently as this week? It has been suggested that that would be disrespectful towards the photographer.

Short of linking photos where we feel the screening may have been slightly (or way) off the mark, what kind of constructive inputs are you suggesting we put forward? I do not feel that we should tell the screeners how to do their job (not job, but you know what I mean), but what if we feel the need to take issue with some of the photos that have been accepted?

I agree that concerns need to be raised in a more civil manner than we have seen in some of the posts on this thread, but having taken this up with the screeners, what kind of response can we expect?

Thanks,

shakermaker

[cja]

Frankly, this is all getting a bit silly now. ...........As Peter says, it's only a hobby and we're supposed to enjoy it, not be frustrated by it!

Paul

Well said.


Perhaps its now time to draw a line under this thread??

[Hinkelbein]

It has been suggested that that would be disrespectful towards the photographer.

That suggestion came from me. It is my opinion, others may think differently about this.

But to me, linking a photo and saying "look at this picture, it should never have been accepted" comes across as being rather childish and certainly disrespectful to the photographer.

And I want to add something else: I hop the owner(s)/builder(s) of this site won't get too annoyed by this topic and consider quitting it.
I, and I believe many others as well, like this website very much and appreciate the work done by volunteer screeners.
Besides, I said it in my earlier post in this topic, I always recieve decent answers on questions from forum members and certainly from screeners, so I don't recognize the "problem" as mentioned by the topic starter.

I hope the starter will reconsider his stepping down from the site and not uploading.

[seahawk]

Pointing out faults in the db is not a problem. If you come here and link a photo and say: "I do think that this is not N123AB but N456CD." Then I see no problem.

If you come here and say :"How the hell did you accept that photo. Every idiot sees that this is not N123AB!!!" Well then it is a different matter.

Same with other faults :

"I think there is a dust spot in the upper right corner of this photo, which I noticed while browsing through the pics." I would see no problem.

"How could this photo have been accepted. There is a f***** huge dust spot. How could you miss that???!!!" Might be a problem.

And if you come here and say:

"The screening sucks. The standards suck. And a lot of the lately accepted photos suck." Well then it is yet another level.

I am not saying all guys not fully happy with the screening are saying this. I know many of you are just trying to give us some input to improve the process as far as possible.

[shakermaker]

But to me, linking a photo and saying "look at this picture, it should never have been accepted" comes across as being rather childish and certainly disrespectful to the photographer.

I did not dispute that, I just pointed out that it was suggested and asked for what kind of constructive inputs are to be laid out. You may notice that when I linked Vishal's photo, it was in a question directed at Eadie. I also included my apologies to Vishal in that same post and I think that he will certainly agree with me when I say that I appreciate his contributions to the database.

I believe many others as well, like this website very much and appreciate the work done by volunteer screeners.

Sorry, I do not like how you insinuate that, just because we point out areas where something could have been done better, we have no appreciation for the work done by the screeners. That is just wrong. I agree with the screeners on this site that not only do we need to be open about things that we feel strongly about, but we need to do so in a friendly manner instead of being so dead blunt about it.

And if you come here and say:

"The screening sucks. The standards suck. And a lot of the lately accpeted photos suck." Well then it is yet another level.

We had one guy who came in and said that and you're going to paint us all with the same brush?

[PMN]

Original deleted by me as nobody is reading the posts. The who point is that something is very wrong with the screening... but this will not be accepted so no point in talking about it.

People are reading posts, Daryl. I've read every single word you've written, it's just that you have yet to come up with a detailed and articulate post giving reasons why you think there's a problem. All you've done is fire off at Gerardo (rightly or wrongly is irrelevent), and 'shout' using captial letters (which, I might add, infuriates me).

Forget the emotion, forget the personal problems you have with people and give a step by step explanation detailing the exact problems you see and you might actually get somewhere. You're really not helping yourself in the way you're going about this. If there is a problem, let's try solve it. You're not even attempting to solve anything at the moment.

Paul

[seahawk]

We had one guy who came in and said that and you're going to paint us all with the same brush?

No, I merely wanted to say, that there are constructive ways to comment on faults you see in the screening and less constructive ways. I know many of the posters here in this discussion, who are not fully happy with the screening, are just trying to give really constructive input and all I am trying to point out is, that there are ways to do just this in a positive manner.

[Hinkelbein]

Sorry, I do not like how you insinuate that, just because we point out areas where something could have been done better, we have no appreciation for the work done by the screeners

When you quote me, you must quote the whole sentence.
The piece you quoted COULD insinuate that, but the WHOLE COMPLETE sentence doesn't!

[shakermaker]

Alright Hinkelbein but please understand that you are denouncing a very small minority. Don't just casually discount the fact that there are those who are crazy about this site, who feel that there is room for improvement and have gone on to express themselves and that a response is needed (well, would be nice anyway)!

If they didn't care they would have left without saying a word. If I didn't care I would just as soon take my (handful of) pictures down and delete my account.

[Hinkelbein]

Alright Hinkelbein but please understand that you are denouncing a very small minority. Don't just casually discount the fact that there are those who are crazy about this site, who feel that there is room for improvement and have gone on to express themselves and that a response is needed (well, would be nice anyway)!

If they didn't care they would have left without saying a word. If I didn't care I would just as soon take my (handful of) pictures down and delete my account.

I fear I was misunderstood. Possible, because English is not my mother tongue.

I do not want to denounce whoever.

I understand your words and I completely agree.

Greets,

Hinkelbein

[LX-A343]

Gerardo, are you suggesting that we link photos that have been accepted with bad data as recently as this week? It has been suggested that that would be disrespectful towards the photographer.

What I meant, was, that those things I quoted are simply acusations, posted in a bad manner, which do not point to a solution, but more to some sort of dissing people.

One possibility could be, first to send in the corrections, which helps us a lot, and if you see for example one specific error we regularely make, start a topic, post it here in a polite way, and that's it. If you post a picture in such a context, I don't see a problem. So, instead of "How can this photo be accepted?" simply write "I have seen many photos of this aircraft with this wrong info [link to an example]". Sounds better for all involved.

Regarding infos: No question, we accept some wrong infos. Some of them are negligence from our side, and we regularely point it out in teh crew forum. But keep also in mind, that we can't know everything. Example: everything smaller than an A319/B737 is for me considered as ... well .... "uninteresting" (sorry folks, just different tastes ). So, send me any small prop and put whatever you want, I'll believe you.

But we have with AJ, Alberto and other crew members one hell of a master data knowledge database. They let us know regularely, what to look for. In addition, we have the possibility to send photos from the screening page directly to data review, while the photo itself is accepted.

We could of course spend some time in correct info checking, the problem would then be the queue length.

Short of linking photos where we feel the screening may have been slightly (or way) off the mark, what kind of constructive inputs are you suggesting we put forward? I do not feel that we should tell the screeners how to do their job (not job, but you know what I mean), but what if we feel the need to take issue with some of the photos that have been accepted?

A delicate subject, no doubt. Question: how would you react, if somebody asks, why a photo of yours has been accepted, even if all can see, that it is way off the mark? I wouldn't like it, TBH.

First of all don't forget, we are some 40 screeners. So, what seems e.g. overexposed, but borderline acceptable to one, is borderline not acceptable for another. What seems off the mark for you, may be OK for others. And then, we always tell the screeners, if doubts -> accept. Look for a reason to accept. The other way is well known: look for reasons to reject. We are not looking for that.

Just an idea: I have done this on A.net .... a looooong time ago: I asked the photog, whose photo I wanted to present as example, if he was OK with this.

But here as well: "c'est le ton qui fait la musique", it's the tone which makes the music. And if unsure, send a mail to the screeners, instead of posting something in the forum.

[shakermaker]

What I meant, was, that those things I quoted are simply acusations, posted in a bad manner, which do not point to a solution, but more to some sort of dissing people.

I agree that there are better ways to highlight inaccuracies than has been done.

One possibility could be, first to send in the corrections, which helps us a lot, and if you see for example one specific error we regularely make, start a topic, post it here in a polite way, and that's it. If you post a picture in such a context, I don't see a problem. So, instead of "How can this photo be accepted?" simply write "I have seen many photos of this aircraft with this wrong info [link to an example]". Sounds better for all involved.

I usually submit the corrections straight away. Best way to take it up, I feel. But I will go with your suggestions for any image that I find to be an exception (for instance, wrong type and reg.).

We could of course spend some time in correct info checking, the problem would then be the queue length.

Having seen the queue length grow significantly from back when I first started uploading here to the way it is now, I understand that concern. If, however, the screeners focus a wee bit more on this now, while it might initially add to screening time, would you agree that they will get better at it in no time and the screening time will be closer to what it is now?

A delicate subject, no doubt. Question: how would you react, if somebody asks, why a photo of yours has been accepted, even if all can see, that it is way off the mark? I wouldn't like it, TBH.

I hear you and, in hindsight, feel I should have taken this up with Vishal before posting his photo, albeit with my apologies. But that is all good now.

First of all don't forget, we are some 40 screeners. So, what seems e.g. overexposed, but borderline acceptable to one, is borderline not acceptable for another. What seems off the mark for you, may be OK for others. And then, we always tell the screeners, if doubts -> accept. Look for a reason to accept. The other way is well known: look for reasons to reject. We are not looking for that.

That is naturally the case, but that is not what we are posting about, we are also reasonable people. It's the exceptions that we take issue with.

Just an idea: I have done this on A.net .... a looooong time ago: I asked the photog, whose photo I wanted to present as example, if he was OK with this.

Sounds good to me. Also, if we can agree with the screeners and the photographer about the photo, perhaps the re-upload function could be brought to use? I did that once to remove a dustspot and without changing the photo itself.

But here as well: "c'est le ton qui fait la musique", it's the tone which makes the music. And if unsure, send a mail to the screeners, instead of posting something in the forum.

Thanks for your response, Gerardo. Much appreciated.

Cheers,

shakermaker

[LX-A343]

I usually submit the corrections straight away. Best way to take it up, I feel. But I will go with your suggestions for any image that I find to be an exception (for instance, wrong type and reg.).

Depends on what you try to achieve. If you want that specific photo to be corrected, send in a correction. If you see, that we accept the same photo with the same wrong photos times and times again, post it here.

Cheers
Gerardo

[RingwaySam]

Calm down fellas. It's a hobby, im sure we don't all go to the airport just so we can come home and upload to JetPhotos. I've met some great people through the site so im glad JP is here but theres worse things happening in the world than getting you're pictures rejected. Calm down, look at the reasons and work on it. You don't become a good photographer by getting all you're shots accepted whether there as petty as a date rejection.

Let's not make it into the other site with all bitching and so on!

[JordanD]

im sure we don't all go to the airport just so we can come home and upload to JetPhotos.

Sadly I can name a few people that do.