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United Airlines - May Purchase 150 Planes

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  • #16
    Originally posted by IntheShade View Post
    I hate to advocate the shutdown of any airline but in the big scheme of things the industry would be better without United.
    United is widely credited with throwing the industry's whole cost structure out of whack back in the 90's. They gave sweetheart contracts to their unions, and the rest of the industry players had to match them in order to stay competitive and retain their people. So by the beginning of this decade, the costs of the legacy carriers had become so bloated as to be unsupportable. The rest is history.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Verbal View Post
      United is widely credited with throwing the industry's whole cost structure out of whack back in the 90's. They gave sweetheart contracts to their unions, and the rest of the industry players had to match them in order to stay competitive and retain their people. So by the beginning of this decade, the costs of the legacy carriers had become so bloated as to be unsupportable. The rest is history.
      Concur

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      • #18
        That's a bit going too far in asking for UA's operating certificate to be removed there ITS, but you're right as well as tommyalf in that management is at fault here. I've flown on UA a couple of times and except for when they lost my luggage and took them 2 months to find it, I've never had really any problems with them.

        I have to agree with what you said there rohank in that I'm as well a bit surprised that they're not looking at the 747-8I as a replacement to the 744. They have parked a couple of 744s already but some of them already have had new interior installed so it would make sense why they wouldn't decide on replacing them.

        Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.


        I agree also that they would order more A319/A320s to replace their aging 737s. It'll be interesting if they do what you said and ordered the 787-3 to replace the 757 as the 787-3 has only been ordered by JAL and ANA. As for their 767s, they ought to do what AA is doing in installing blended winglets on them and order the 787-8 or 9. For the 777, they have 52, according to united's website, so they're good there. I don't believe that UA will order any wide body aircrafts from Airbus, A330/A350, as they have been loyal to Boeing in launching the 777 and having 747s.
        what ever happens......happens

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Eric Diffoot View Post
          I agree also that they would order more A319/A320s to replace their aging 737s. It'll be interesting if they do what you said and ordered the 787-3 to replace the 757 as the 787-3 has only been ordered by JAL and ANA. As for their 767s, they ought to do what AA is doing in installing blended winglets on them and order the 787-8 or 9. For the 777, they have 52, according to united's website, so they're good there. I don't believe that UA will order any wide body aircrafts from Airbus, A330/A350, as they have been loyal to Boeing in launching the 777 and having 747s.
          I posted it earlier in this thread, but for reasons known only to themselves the mods removed it. So I will repeat it here. I have read elsewhere that this will be a winner-take-all contract. So no split order.

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          • #20
            Did you have proof earlier Verbal that the order would not be a split order and that it would be just one big order from one manufacturer?

            From reading this article you may be right in that it will be one big order from either Airbus or Boeing but we won't know for sure until they acutally place the order. It's called speculation.


            United looking at Dreamliner, other jets to replace its fleet


            Boeing's 787 Dreamliner could figure prominently in United Airline's plans to replace all of the large jets in its fleet as well as some older narrow-body planes.

            Chicago-based United opened a high-stakes contest for an order for as many as 150 planes by sending requests for proposals to Boeing Co. and Airbus SAS.

            United is expected to drive a tough bargain with the planemakers, who are struggling to land sales while they cope with delays and cancellations from other airline customers amid a depressed market for aircraft sales.

            And any aircraft deal will likely include some financing provided by the winning manufacturer, given the tough credit markets, say people close to United.


            United's bid proposal didn't make specific reference to the model of aircraft it intends to purchase, these people said.

            However, United for months has been studying three versions of the 787 Dreamliner as a replacement for its Boeing 757, 767 and 777 aircraft, the larger of which ferry its passengers from North America to Europe or Asia, sources said.

            In a surprise to some aviation analysts, United is looking into the smaller version of the Dreamliner, the 787-3, which has garnered only orders from a handful of Japanese carriers.

            The plane is still on the drawing boards and its development has been pushed back as Boeing struggles to fix production problems with the first Dreamliner, the 787-8. It is expected to take its first flight this month.

            The nation's third-largest carrier is also mulling the long-range Boeing 777-300ER as a replacement for its fleet of Boeing 747 jumbo jets. It is also looking at next-generation 737s, sources said.

            "We are taking a hard look at all aircraft that potentially meet our replacement needs," said United spokeswoman Jean Medina.

            United, the nation's third-largest carrier, is also interested in the A350-XWB, an Airbus jet still on the drawing boards designed to overlap between the 787 and 777 in range and the number of passengers it could accommodate.

            And United also reportedly would consider an updated version of the A330, spruced up with "next-generation" engines that would give it greater fuel efficiency.

            Spokespeople for United, Boeing and Airbus confirmed the aircraft contest but declined to say which models are being discussed.

            United last took delivery of new jets in 2002 and is the only major U.S. carrier that hasn't ordered new jets since the airline industry entered a tailspin following the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks.

            Although United has held ongoing talks with Boeing and Airbus in recent years, the carrier said it preferred to upgrade the first-class cabins of its jets rather than take on the debt and financial risk that accompanies a large aircraft order.

            But in recent weeks, the nation's No. 3 carrier decided to take advantage of a global aviation collapse that has left Boeing and Airbus scrambling to find takers for some of the large jets rolling out of their factories.

            United has also been hurt by a fall-off in first and business-class travel, especially on its routes across the Pacific, where it competes against Asian carriers boasting new aircraft packed with amenities like state-of-the-art entertainment systems.

            In a message to employees, Thursday, United CEO Glenn Tilton said the Chicago-based carrier sent a request for proposal to the rival plane-makers earlier this week "that could result in a potentially significant number that could ultimately replace our widebody fleet." It hopes to place the order by this fall for deliveries that would stretch over many years, Tilton said.

            But some in aviation circles remain skeptical that United will be able to line up financing for a purchase that could run well north of $10 billion.

            Carriers must provide pre-delivery payments to Boeing and Airbus to cover their manufacturing costs. However, financing for such payments "just doesn't exist these days," said Toby Bright, chief marketing officer for Sky Holding Co., an aircraft leasing company based in San Francisco.
            what ever happens......happens

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            • #21
              Hello can you provide a quote for 150 aircraft. I assume I'll get a volume discount.

              Fast forward to 2015 -

              Um, yeah I'll cancel the order for the remaining 120 aircraft, please deliver the 30 as per our contracted price dated 2009.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Eric Diffool View Post
                Did you have proof earlier Verbal that the order would not be a split order and that it would be just one big order from one manufacturer?
                Eric, it took me about 60 seconds of searching on http://www.theseinternets.com/ to find it.

                United Plans Huge Jet Order
                Boeing, Airbus to Vie for Possible Purchase Worth $10 Billion; Exploiting the Slump

                By SUSAN CAREY

                United Airlines has asked Boeing Co. and Airbus to propose dueling bids for up to 150 new airliners -- the latest example of major companies exploiting the recession to bargain-hunt.

                For the two aircraft makers, the deal could be worth more than $10 billion at a time when both are watching other customers cancel or defer orders. By staging a winner-take-all competition, United's parent, UAL Corp., is hoping to obtain better terms than otherwise might be available, according to people familiar with the situation.
                Linky.

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                • #23
                  Well thanks for clarifying there Verbal and I think Boeing will win the order.
                  what ever happens......happens

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Eric Diffoot View Post
                    Well thanks for clarifying there Verbal and I think Boeing will win the order.
                    Very interesting. I originally believed that UA was always intending to do a split order. I agree, with Eric D., Boeing will most likely win the order. The fact that UA is looking at the Boeing 737NG is surprising, unless they get a huge discount, would it really be worth the extra expense of running a split fleet, instead, of ordering 20-30 more A319/A320s and just transfering the remaining Boeing 737 pilots over to the Airbus A319/320? UA has already transfered several former 737-300/500 pilots over to the newer A319/320s. As for the Boeing 757 replacement, I think the only plane that would work, is the Boeing 787-3. As stated before, the efficiency of the Airbus A321 just isn't comparable to that of the Boeing 757.

                    Rohan

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