Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

JAL filling for Bankruptcy

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • JAL filling for Bankruptcy

    JAL is filling for BK in the next few days.....

    A Former Airdisaster.Com Forum (senior member)....

  • #2
    Will be interesting to see how the JAL story continues. There's still the OneWorld vs. SkyTeam battle ahead

    Comment


    • #3
      Do failures like this iimply the business model used for management decisions wasn't sustainable, that previous survival was pure luck?

      Comment


      • #4
        I think that they just weren't correctly adapted/adapting to the change in the market. Mind you, the global recession hasn't helped.
        Regards

        Scott


        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by EconomyClass View Post
          Do failures like this imply the business model used for management decisions wasn't sustainable, that previous survival was pure luck?

          There are some interesting comments in this article about How and Why JAL is in this situation.


          When the state influences the management of an airline it usually means a big bill for the tax payer in the end. The question is, is it worth it? Again the creditors will have to pick up the pieces while a fundamentally inefficient airline is allowed to carry on, (although one would hope with an improved business model).
          Last edited by cja; 2010-01-11, 14:10.


          Comment


          • #6
            There is an stampede of shareholders selling their (JAL) stocks today!

            BBC, News, BBC News, news online, world, uk, international, foreign, british, online, service
            A Former Airdisaster.Com Forum (senior member)....

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Peter Kesternich View Post
              Will be interesting to see how the JAL story continues. There's still the OneWorld vs. SkyTeam battle ahead
              I wondered why (by now) that decision and the rather large sum of money (in excess of 1 Billion USD) was not yet made (and subsequently, funds injected). Is the government of Japan waiting for the airline to enter into Chapter 11 in order for the money to have greater effect? Or, is their procrastination on the part of DAL and AMR (and their affiliates namely Alliance members that are willing to pledge funds)?

              Sadly, this will not be the first time that OneWorld has lost an airline from the alliance due to financial sittutations. I hope that they are able to do as so many other airlines (such as DL) have done and emerge as stronger, better managed and with a renewed focus on the market in which they actually operate. A miracle, would be for them to accomplish that and still stay within OneWorld. I am hoping for said miracle.
              Whatever is necessary, is never unwise.

              Comment


              • #8
                Is there a good history article on how JAL got here? I'm thinking Al Qaeda might be a big part of the story. Their plans have had huge global collateral damage.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by EconomyClass View Post
                  Is there a good history article on how JAL got here? I'm thinking Al Qaeda might be a big part of the story. Their plans have had huge global collateral damage.
                  That's a strange notion. Al Qaeda's influence on East Asian airlines has been considerably less than on Western airlines, and almost zero in JAL's case. JAL's problems arise from three main reasons : a) the airline, while now privatized, has essentially been run for too long as a government department, b) it has been affected by the long period of economic decline in Japan, and c) it has been affected by more nimble competition from All Nippon.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    And birds flu was also not good for many Asian carriers either. But most of the problems are home made.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Oneworld airlines make determined bid to keep JAL in alliance

                      The oneworld carriers say that if JAL stays within their alliance, it will benefit from some US$2 billion worth of commercial benefits.

                      "We believe our proposal is in the best interests of JAL and its employees and customers, and the government and taxpayers of Japan," notes Tom Horton, American Airlines CFO.
                      http://www.etravelblackboard.com/sho...=130&id=100944
                      GlobalAirportsOnline

                      Book flights at
                      http://www.globalairportsonline.com

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I'm not sure about how closely other alliances work but there doesn't seem to be as much sharing of flight networks in One World as there could be.

                        For example JL and QF don't seem to have any arrangements to book passengers on each others flights (except a few flights they code share between the 2 Countries). On the Qantas website you can only book flights to one Japanese destination (Tokyo). Surely if they got together they could arrange for connecting flights to be booked on each others domestic networks?

                        And why can't they share each other's international routes better. If you're flying from Australia to Russia you can easily buy a joint Aeroflot/Qantas ticket, usually at a reasonable price, from Aeroflot's Sydney office. Given JL and QF are One World partners it should be even more easy to fly to Moscow on QF/JL (or even QF/AY). But the only route offered to MOW on the QF website is via LHR with BA! In this way the myriad of possible NRT connections using one world partners is (IMHO) largely wasted. The situation with with QF & CX at HKG is the same, great hub, great connections but no apparent sharing of networks.

                        It seems a bit late now for the likes of AA, BA and the other OW carriers to be throwing Carrots & Please Pardon Me's to JL. If they had started working together as a team and pooling their resources 10 years ago they might not be in the situation they are today (i.e. with 4 of their carriers; JL, BA, AA & AY being invariably unprofitable and relying on financial engineering tools such as Bankruptcy pardons and Mergers to survive).

                        Having said that the Devil you know maybe preferable to the Devil you don't know. Delta and JL may have considerable route and other synergies but if JL thinks getting into bed with them will solve their problems they'll likely be disappointed. Delta may be doing better than the other US Airlines atm but that hardly says much. They've needed Chapter 11 before and probably will again. And since JL is currently broke while DL is (temporarily at least) solvent any deals will be done with DL sitting is a position of strength. It's not exactly a strong Poker table but DL is the chip leader and JL is decidedly short stacked. They also need to think through the pros and cons of the other players on each team. For mine AF/KLM/SU look a better bet than BA/AY/IB so Skyteam maybe has the edge in Europe. But in Asia Pacific CX/QF/LA/MX beats KE/CZ/AM.

                        In the end the way JL addresses it's internal problems is probably more important than which alliance it chooses. But whoever they go with they will need to cooperate much more closely with than they have with their OW partners to date.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Well - I have never been a big fan of OneWorld and how they handle things within their alliance. Does anybody remember how they left founding member Canadian Airlines to the vultures?

                          That said, I think SkyTeam will definitely be a smart choice for JAL (and many other airlines as well). Admittedly, SkyTeam is not as strong yet in Asia, but they are working on it, with Vietnam Airlines joing in 2010, Garuda getting sponsored for an application by KLM these days, and maybe Malaysia Airlines will make up their mind as well and apply.

                          ... oh - and please nobody start that thing again about Korean being unhappy with JAL coming over. In Star Alliance, Asiana and ANA are perfectly happy together, so Korean and JAL should do fine as well.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Bankruptcy confirmed....filed this morning..!
                            BBC, News, BBC News, news online, world, uk, international, foreign, british, online, service

                            A Former Airdisaster.Com Forum (senior member)....

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by AA 1818 View Post
                              I wondered why (by now) that decision and the rather large sum of money (in excess of 1 Billion USD) was not yet made (and subsequently, funds injected). Is the government of Japan waiting for the airline to enter into Chapter 11 in order for the money to have greater effect? Or, is their procrastination on the part of DAL and AMR (and their affiliates namely Alliance members that are willing to pledge funds)?

                              Sadly, this will not be the first time that OneWorld has lost an airline from the alliance due to financial sittutations. I hope that they are able to do as so many other airlines (such as DL) have done and emerge as stronger, better managed and with a renewed focus on the market in which they actually operate. A miracle, would be for them to accomplish that and still stay within OneWorld. I am hoping for said miracle.
                              Well theyv'e decided to stay within OW so I guess part of your miracle has come true! The Japanese Govt will no doubt fill their coffers up again so they should be fine for another decade or two.

                              Whether they squander their new found wealth or learn to manage it better will be fascinating but I not planning to buy their shares anytime soon.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X