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MD-80 / DC-9 Stall Exercise

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  • MD-80 / DC-9 Stall Exercise

    Anyone have background on this one?

    https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=uUeWs_1594167866

  • #2
    No, but it looks like an upset recovery exercise rather than a stall exercise.

    --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
    --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

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    • #3
      Stupid question- is this a real airplane? The bright sunlight beam and the guys leaning reactions [and most importantly the post-maneuver bromance shoulder slaps] look very real, but I was a little surprised to hear the over speed warning, if it’s a real aeroplanie.
      Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

      Comment


      • #4
        You know what? You have a very good point. I think I need to go back and eat my words.
        It is something I had not even payed attention, but yes it looks real.
        And the comments in the YouTube version of the video agree.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...ature=emb_logo

        Development / certification test flight?

        --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
        --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

        Comment


        • #5
          I flew the DC-9 and it does look like they are in a real airplane, sun in the windscreen. Curious how he has almost full right aileron with what appears to be both throttles up maybe half way. Possibly the instructor is holding full rudder or one engine was shutdown. Left seat pilot was new to this as after the nose drops he's slow to reduce the power and deploy the speed brakes. You can see his body react as the the aircraft rolls left and the nose drops.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by kent olsen View Post
            I flew the DC-9 and it does look like they are in a real airplane, sun in the windscreen. Curious how he has almost full right aileron with what appears to be both throttles up maybe half way. Possibly the instructor is holding full rudder or one engine was shutdown. Left seat pilot was new to this as after the nose drops he's slow to reduce the power and deploy the speed brakes. You can see his body react as the the aircraft rolls left and the nose drops.
            Apparently, this was not a rookie with an instructor, they were 2 very experienced test pilots and this was a development or certification test flight.
            Also apparently, they were testing slow flight or stalls in turns, and the plane stalled. That is why, some say in the comments, they don't recover immediately, they need to reduce AoA first and get some airspeed before they can pull Gs from the wings.

            I was still surprised by the recovery. In the beginning the plane rolled inverted but the nose did not go down so much. According to standardized upset recovery procedure (which I don't know if they had already been developed back then) they should have first pushed down to less than zero G (which would have also immediately recovered the stall), rolled with ailerons towards the roll index, used same-direction rudder (which would have been "up" rudder) to minimize how much the nose goes down, and as the bank goes into not-inverted reverse the push with a pull (only now minding about not to stall, don't pull past stickshaker AoA). It looks to me that the recovery could have been done much quicker, with much less altitude loss and possibly no overspeed.

            Some in the comment say that, per test flight standards, they needed to wait 3 seconds before starting the recovery for "human reaction time allowance". I have my doubts.

            I would love to learn the whole and true story of this.

            --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
            --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by kent olsen View Post
              Curious how he has almost full right aileron with what appears to be both throttles up maybe half way.
              Why would we do something like that?
              Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by kent olsen View Post
                Curious how he has almost full right aileron with what appears to be both throttles up maybe half way. Possibly the instructor is holding full rudder or one engine was shutdown.
                According to Pprune this was a steady state sideslip certification test. This was the first one done without the attitude recovery chute tailcone and the stall characteristics were quite different.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Gabriel View Post

                  According to standardized upset recovery procedure (which I don't know if they had already been developed back then) they should have first pushed down to less than zero G (which would have also immediately recovered the stall)...
                  Wouldn't you need to pull rather than push when inverted to get the nose down?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Evan View Post

                    Wouldn't you need to pull rather than push when inverted to get the nose down?
                    "Push down" is an expression that means just "push". The "down" part is relative to the pilot's / airplane's frame of reference, not the Earth's.

                    You don't want to get the nose down when you are in a nose-down unusual attitude. YOu want to minimize altitude loss and having the airplane pointed towards the Earth is counterproductive.

                    --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
                    --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Evan View Post

                      According to Pprune this was a steady state sideslip certification test. This was the first one done without the attitude recovery chute tailcone and the stall characteristics were quite different.
                      Can you please post the relevant PPRuNe link?

                      --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
                      --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Gabriel View Post

                        Can you please post the relevant PPRuNe link?
                        That took some digging and now I've lost it. Do you have a shovel?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Gabriel View Post

                          Can you please post the relevant PPRuNe link?
                          Meanwhile, there is also this:

                          https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/623...7-not-sim.html

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Test.
                            That's what airlines are good for, amongst others,
                            The Gold Member in the 747 club, 50 years since the first LH 747.
                            And constantly advanced, 744 and 748 /w upper and lower EICAS.
                            Aviation enthusiast, since more than 35 years with home airport EDDL.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hm. Our beloved forum server here again seems to show one or two technical problems.. Gabe, what do you do if your computer does not do what you want to do?
                              Kick that thing in the a**, right?

                              Back on topic.

                              Wasn't it possible for that Junior threadstarter to give us the original youtube link. But I'll forgive him. He still seems so shiny new, after all those years..

                              Online since 2015, but I've seen that video for the first time today. This is the original source:
                              https://youtu.be/L2CsO-Vu7oc

                              I have one question, 'it’s real life and not in the sim', somebody said. I could second what he says, but what is that small window in the upper right corner, at 00:35.

                              Where does that come from?

                              PS: Fsx is able to produce such a window. But the cockpit seems like what I know from jetphotos, from a real B744 cockpit. That cockpit seems to be real.
                              Last edited by LH-B744; 2020-07-13, 23:57. Reason: + the Original source.
                              That's what airlines are good for, amongst others,
                              The Gold Member in the 747 club, 50 years since the first LH 747.
                              And constantly advanced, 744 and 748 /w upper and lower EICAS.
                              Aviation enthusiast, since more than 35 years with home airport EDDL.

                              Comment

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