Originally posted by Gabriel
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Originally posted by kent olsen View PostHe says "did you turn off the autopilot?" I said yes. Then he says "are going to hand fly the airplane in the clouds?" I said "yes". Then he says "but that means I have to watch you and everything". I said yes that's what it means PM, pilot monitoring.
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Originally posted by kent olsen View Post"The hero was the Aircraft"? I guess Airbus designed the aircraft to be flown by idiots..
Would you rather have an airplane designed for the average pilot and let the 50% that is below average crash them on a daily basis? Because there will be ALWAYS ro% of pilots that are below the average, that's the very definition of "average" (actually, it is de definition of median, but I digress).
So yes, designing a plane to be flown by the worst pilots that will ever fly them (or for good pilots in their worst day) is the way to go.
Now, we can discuss, agree, or disagree with how it was implemented. But again I digress.
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Originally posted by kent olsen View Post"The hero was the Aircraft"? I guess Airbus designed the aircraft to be flown by idiots.
One of my last trips in the Citation X descending into Las Vegas, 1500 overcast, tops about 15,000. I turned off the autopilot at FL180 as I usually did, to hand fly to the airport. My new, young, FO says "what was that, what was that". I asked "what did you see?" He says "did you turn off the autopilot?" I said yes. Then he says "are going to hand fly the airplane in the clouds?" I said "yes". Then he says "but that means I have to watch you and everything". I said yes that's what it means PM, pilot monitoring. Not to long after that I retired.
But I'm talking about monitoring automation. We have seen too many incidents caused by pilots with plenty of skill and confidence in manual flying who have failed to monitor their automation.
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"The hero was the Aircraft"? I guess Airbus designed the aircraft to be flown by idiots.
One of my last trips in the Citation X descending into Las Vegas, 1500 overcast, tops about 15,000. I turned off the autopilot at FL180 as I usually did, to hand fly to the airport. My new, young, FO says "what was that, what was that". I asked "what did you see?" He says "did you turn off the autopilot?" I said yes. Then he says "are going to hand fly the airplane in the clouds?" I said "yes". Then he says "but that means I have to watch you and everything". I said yes that's what it means PM, pilot monitoring. Not to long after that I retired.
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Originally posted by Gabriel View Post1st act: What is the Pilot Monitoring doing now?
2nd act: What is the A320 doing now?
3rd act: What is the Pilot Flying doing now?
Poor passengers....
In the end, the PF eventually succeeded to control the plane in a very confusing situation, my sympathies for that.
But apparently they only understood "why the plane was doing that" only after everything went back to normal. Which is fine in principle.
But, in hindsight, the pilots should have FULLY clicked-clacked it (AP off, AT off, FD off) the instant that they started to wonder "what is it doing now". If you don't understand what the automation is doing, remove the automation, control the plane manually, fully stabilize the situation, and only then analyze "why was it doing that".
http://avherald.com/h?article=49de3dbc&opt=234
Continuous, detailed overviewing and full understanding of the operation of such heavily automated systems like an Airbus A320 aircraft typically exceeds the possibilities of an average operator.
If you aren't monitoring the FMA, you might as well let go of the other controls as well. You are no longer flying the plane.
Upon initiating a go-around on the A320, both the PF and the PM must verify that the modes are MAN TOGA/SRS/GA-TRK. That's the job in 2021. If they aren't MAN TOGA/SRS/GA-TRK (and you've confirmed that the thrust levers are fully in the TOGA detent), then click-clack the automation off (not armed) until you understand why they aren't.
And EVERY A320 pilot must know instinctively that returning the thrust levers into the A/T range with the A/T armed will engage the A/T to follow the current AP vertical mode, which is displayed in the FMA right TF in front of you!
And yet the IC (whois the IC?) wants to blame the aircraft. The hero of this story is the aircraft, which ignored the command to retract slats below a safe airspeed, thank god.
FMA____ANNOUNCE:
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What is it doing now?
1st act: What is the Pilot Monitoring doing now?
2nd act: What is the A320 doing now?
3rd act: What is the Pilot Flying doing now?
Poor passengers....
In the end, the PF eventually succeeded to control the plane in a very confusing situation, my sympathies for that.
But apparently they only understood "why the plane was doing that" only after everything went back to normal. Which is fine in principle.
But, in hindsight, the pilots should have FULLY clicked-clacked it (AP off, AT off, FD off) the instant that they started to wonder "what is it doing now". If you don't understand what the automation is doing, remove the automation, control the plane manually, fully stabilize the situation, and only then analyze "why was it doing that".
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