B-17 Midair Collision at Dallas Airshow

[B757300]

A B-17 and a small aircraft collided at a show at the Dallas Executive Airport. No articles yet, video @ the link below.

https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1591520040431534086

https://twitter.com/Galnet3/status/1591521871119659008

From the second video (appeared after I started this thread), the smaller plane just rammed right into the B-17.

[fleckenmann]

Looking horrible. Almost like an intended collision by the small plane

[xspeedy]

Not only loss of life, but the loss of a rare airworthy B-17. Shame.

[JuklicekCZ]

Looking horrible. Almost like an intended collision by the small plane

It could be just a miscalculated manoeuvre, such accidents are sadly not uncommon at airshows.

[Cameron W]

Why would someone purposely crash a rare P-63? Does not sound likely at all. These pilots know their risks. As other people have said it is most likely a miscalculated maneuver. Or the fact that he couldn't see the B17 becuase they were banking left and the wing probably covered the B17 in the P-63's view. It was not on purpose. No pilot flying a warbird would ever crash on purpose.

[JeffInDFW]

I am including a link to another video on Twitter of the accident. If you watch, you will see one fighter sized aircraft fly directly overhead, then a second fly overhead. It seems as if they are running in a direct pattern. You see the B17 well off to the left. As the third fighter sized aircraft (the P63) comes into frame, it is swinging well wide of the route taken by the other aircraft over to the left. As the camera swings 180 degrees you see the P63 continue to push well outside of the path taken by the other aircraft until it overtakes and collides with the B17 from the rear. Of course, maybe the B17 was closer to the fighters flight box than it should have been, I have no way to know.

Commentary: An airworthy B-17 is such an irreplaceable treasure. The video I saw of the formation flying earlier in the day concerned me. A very large number of fighter sized aircraft flying in tight formation with the B-17. Why risk the B-17? IMO, no other aircraft need to be anywhere near it. That is just my opinion. Finally, why have it flying at the same altitude as the fighters doing the circuits of the airfield? I was lucky enough to fly on Aluminum Overcast (A B-17) with a group of WWII veterans years ago. I feel for the lives lost in this accident, but I selfishly admit the loss of the B-17 really hurts.

Here is the link to the video I referenced above.

https://twitter.com/shanermurph/status/1591524085967749121?s=21&fbclid=IwAR2gE-bbGbjyQRVsTyBWPRrpV9k0vHRc88x1WWCglz_hS1IOtrKYn1-fpKo

[sjwk]

Number of fatalities has been given as 6.

Some other videos from completely different angles:

https://twitter.com/MatheusBattarra/status/1591539988206059521

https://twitter.com/arnau99999/status/1591544842785796097

I'm sure there'll be an investigation in due course.

[Evan]

Why would someone purposely crash a rare P-63? Does not sound likely at all.

This has to be pilot incapacitation or a control failure. Just terribly bad luck that the two paths met.

[Gabriel]

This has to be pilot incapacitation or a control failure

Evan, is that you? Are you ok?

You can't find any other plausible explanation? like the pilot of a low-ing plane with a long nose (the plane, not the pilot) making a left turn failing to see and avoid another plane that was largely obscured from view by that low wing and long nose?

I mean, it's not saying that failing to see and avoid is the most common cause in mid-airs, but.. Oh wait it is.

[Evan]

Evan, is that you? Are you ok?

You can't find any other plausible explanation? like the pilot of a low-ing plane with a long nose (the plane, not the pilot) making a left turn...

While flying in a rehearsed low-pass formation accompanying the B-17 on the right (looked to me like a right turn)? Why would a pilot do that?

BTW: The pilot on the Kingcobra sits about in line with the wing's leading edge and should have good downward forward visibility.

[Gabriel]

They were not flying in formation. They were flying different flight paths. The B-17 was essentially flying straight and the Kincora was on an intersecting course from the left and turning left to a more parallel course. The B-17 was not simply ahead of the Kingcobra. The NTSB will surely analyze their relative positions and attitudes, and the visibility from one to the other, but it looks to me that they were both moving more or in the same direction one next to the other, and since the Kingcobra was to the left and turning left, the B-17 would have been mostly under the Kingcobra ("under" relative to the banked orientation of the fighter, not relative to the ground) rather than to the front.

[kent olsen]

The Cobra didn't appear to be slowing, as to join up with the B-17, but maybe a high speed under the B-17 pass with a pull up on the other side. Maybe the sun got in his eyes or chances are he was an older pilot, like myself, and a combination of closure rate and older vision caused it. I did a lot of flying of our warbirds at the museum here so I have a little experience with some of that flying.

[Evan]

They were not flying in formation. They were flying different flight paths. The B-17 was essentially flying straight and the Kincora was on an intersecting course from the left and turning left to a more parallel course. The B-17 was not simply ahead of the Kingcobra. The NTSB will surely analyze their relative positions and attitudes, and the visibility from one to the other, but it looks to me that they were both moving more or in the same direction one next to the other, and since the Kingcobra was to the left and turning left, the B-17 would have been mostly under the Kingcobra ("under" relative to the banked orientation of the fighter, not relative to the ground) rather than to the front.

OK, I see it in the newer video. A left turning bank that doesn't steepen in time? So, are these things well-rehearsed and choreographed manuevers or just cowboy chaos? Why would they allow a close manuever like that anywhere near what is one of the very last remaining airworthy historic treasures? I understood that these warbirds are piloted by wisened old veterans who probably take special care climbing out of the bathtub. Or is one of them called Maverick...

[Gabriel]

Those are all valid questions. The safety record of the warbirds in airshows and demo flights is not precisely the best. Given pilot and maintenance training deficiencies discovered after previous accidents, it seems that the safer culture is not top-notch either in this environment. But it doesn't need all entities. Some organizations in this niche may be very professional and some very informal. I don't know.

[Gabriel]

Maximus has a vide of the NTSB conference where he superimposed many different videos from different angles, some of them pretty close-up. Man, such a violent mid-air. The Cobra got almost pulverized on impact.