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  • Lay off the airlines...

    Corporate greed hurting ATLcrew's latte experience...

    https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/b...144100030.html
    Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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    • Originally posted by 3WE View Post
      Corporate greed hurting ATLcrew's latte experience...https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/b...144100030.html
      Thankfully, most airport locations are licensed to other companies and are not directly controlled by Fourbucks, but the news are, nevertheless, troubling.

      Comment


      • Well, I supposed 3WE has gone off to make more popcorn... I'm trying to figure out what the hell this argument has to do with a passenger who was not endangering the safety of a flight in any way, or even being 'unruly'. He was just refusing to give up his seat since, as the airline had his money, he felt entitled to sit there. BoeingBobby, I completely agree that no passenger should defy the order of the flight crew on any issue that is not a violation of basic business ethics and human dignity, but this was. If I was in his place I'm pretty sure I would have deplaned and taken it up with the gate agent (who would probably have split by then), but then, I think this guy was a bit more courageous than I am, or than anyone of us is. It always takes someone courageous enough to stand up to injustice before injustice can be overcome.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by ATLcrew View Post
          I'd think being something in the neighborhood of 400lbs (by your own account) has been a lot harder on your knees than being a paramedic...

          You don't sound terribly "comfortable in your retirement".
          336 lbs actually.
          I started in 1980 when just about every patient got carried. There were no lifting aids, just manually loaded chairs and stretchers. If you tried to make someone walk who had maybe a broken arm then management climbed all over you and threatened disciplinary action. We rarely got a mealbreak which as the years went by got worse. When we did eat it was 30 mins with another call waiting bang on the last minute. We were regularly late off duty. In later years this got worse with a 12 hour shift regularly extending to 14 or 15 hours. It is an accepted and proven fact that of the staff who reach retirement age of 65, 20% will be dead within 2 years.
          So yes, I'm not terribly comfortable in my retirement. At least I beat the 20% dead statistic. These days I check for a pulse in the morning and if I find one, I get out of bed. !!!
          Working in the emergency services is immensely satisfying, but they are killers.
          If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

          Comment


          • Originally posted by brianw999 View Post
            So yes, I'm not terribly comfortable in my retirement. At least I beat the 20% dead statistic. These days I check for a pulse in the morning and if I find one, I get out of bed. !!!Working in the emergency services is immensely satisfying, but they are killers.
            As one of my older friends says "if you're over 50, and you wake up feeling no pain anywhere, you're probably dead".

            Comment


            • Originally posted by ATLcrew View Post
              As one of my older friends says "if you're over 50, and you wake up feeling no pain anywhere, you're probably dead".
              Except for the "you wake up" part, that is...

              --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
              --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Gabriel View Post
                Except for the "you wake up" part, that is...


                Within the context of many religions it's valid.
                Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

                Comment


                • Today's Incident

                  The unfriendly skies strike again.

                  http://www.stltoday.com/business/mus...bff3942f7.html

                  Asking for video does seem to stir up airline folks...surprised they didn't zip tie her. I checked the ticket back COC I posted earlier...yep...nothing says you can try to bring a violin on board.
                  Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by 3WE View Post
                    The unfriendly skies strike again.

                    http://www.stltoday.com/business/mus...bff3942f7.html

                    Asking for video does seem to stir up airline folks...surprised they didn't zip tie her. I checked the ticket back COC I posted earlier...yep...nothing says you can try to bring a violin on board.
                    United strikes again. I had a soft camera bag containing in excess of £5,000 worth of equipment as cabin baggage which a gate agent tried to take off of me and put in the hold. I refused and luckily the Captain walked by while we were arguing. Even more luckily, he was a photography enthusiast as well. He told the gate agent to allow the bag into the cabin. The gate agent started to argue until the Captain closely studied the agents ID badge, fixed him with a steely glare and said, very firmly "IT....GOES...IN....THE...CABIN"
                    Which airline was this I hear you asking ?......United strikes again. Thank God for a sensible Captain.
                    If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

                    Comment


                    • from the untied website:

                      Musical instruments

                      Depending on their size, musical instruments can be carried on board, handled as checked baggage, or carried as cabin-seat baggage.

                      In the case of customers who purchased a Basic Economy ticket, a small musical instrument may be carried on instead of a small personal item, subject to the same conditions below. A larger musical instrument that does not fit in the overhead bin and is brought to the gate will be checked to your final destination and subject to the applicable checked baggage fees plus a $25 gate handling charge.
                      As carry-on

                      As part of the allowance of one carry-on bag plus one personal item, a passenger may carry a violin, guitar or other small musical instrument onboard the aircraft if:

                      The instrument can be stowed in the overhead bin or under the seat in front of the passenger; and
                      There is space for stowage at the time when the passenger boards the aircraft

                      Musical instruments transported onboard United and United Express aircraft must be in hard-shell cases.
                      As checked baggage

                      An instrument should be packed in a hard-shell case to keep it protected during normal handling. Excess checked baggage service charges may apply if the customer is checking more than two items. Oversize charges apply to musical instruments that measure 63 - 115 linear inches. Overweight charges apply to musical instruments that are over 50 pounds, but musical instruments weighing up to 165 pounds will be accepted. If the instrument is over 115 linear inches, please contact the United Customer Contact Center.

                      Additionally, customers should loosen the strings on stringed instruments to protect the neck against damage caused by expansion and contraction, which can result from temperature variations during flight.

                      See our Checked Baggage page for additional information about checking items.
                      As cabin-seat baggage

                      United will allow a customer to purchase a seat for a musical instrument that is too fragile or bulky to be handled as checked baggage.

                      Excess Valuation may not be purchased for musical instruments.

                      See our Cabin-seat Baggage page for more information on purchasing a seat for a fragile or bulky item.

                      Comment


                      • Devil's-Advocate-Analytical-Consider-The-Airline's-Side-of-Things moment.

                        What the airlines refuse to admit, is they are attempting to cram as many people and baggage in the cabin/bins as they can, and there simply isn't any provision for a fragile, 5-ft tall, double-bass cello. Nor is there any provision for the baggage crew to truly handle delicate musical instruments, nor leg lamps from Fragile' France...and yeah, definitely not on a regional aircraft where roll-aboard bags don't even fit.

                        And, with overhead space being extremely premium, I wouldn't want to put a violin up there next to bubba and whomever else who is cramming their bulging, carry on suitcase...unless my instrument is in a hellaciously sturdy case.

                        Of course, the training glosses over the real world, and teaches the seller to be all bubbly and nice...yes, we would LOVE to carry your violin...whereas the marketing dept. should say, look, this is bargain basement air-travel...don't bring anything fragile and valuable within 200 ft of the aircraft.

                        I guess if I had a 17th century violin, I'd be buying it a seat...but still, the FAR's and the shape of the thing...not sure you can seat-belt it in...

                        By the way- I guess you better be sure to check in your violin and have a photo ID for it... LOL and actually a tough question...(back to the Evan's argument that the man/woman with the checkbook actually has rights to the seat, and not an individual....
                        Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

                        Comment


                        • 1) Pathological behavior on the part of the supervisor. United is NOT screening and training its people enough to deal with bad days and confrontation. This is the core of the problem.

                          2) A 17th century violin needs to go in a custom fitted foam padded hard shell moisture-proof gasket sealed case with a pressure valve. Then it should be fine under someone's golf clubs and can be dragged about by baggage handling neanderthals. I often travel with sensitive equipment and have exactly this kind of case to protect it. Relative to the instrument, the cases are not even that expensive and, of course, well worth the expense. If the voilin goes in the cabin, it must be either placed under the seat (not going to happen) or in the overhead, next to all the other bags being shoved, crammed and hammered into place by other desperate economy class minions. The airlines used to be cool and let me put my guitars in the closet, but those days seem to be over (the closet is probably an extra row of seats now).

                          The situation could have been handled in a non-escalating way, and then it might have simply resulted in an unhappy customer and not a viral media takedown. WIll they ever learn?

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Evan View Post
                            1) Pathological behavior...blah, blah, blah...Will they ever learn?
                            Wrong.

                            I am sure there is training- and scripts and procedures...(ever notice how near-identical all the boarding announcements are across multiple towns and airlines and countries). Training program is pretty good!

                            But the system is all about screwing passengers AND dealing with POS passengers.

                            The agents have no power and no reason to go the extra mile and especially no support to do so.

                            Perhaps they once cared...now they are trapped...hearding cattle and living LEAN constant improvement projects to boost efficiency- with elapsed boarding times and free standby (when EWR has delays) being scrutinized as lost pennies of profit.

                            They don't care what the training was...management sure as hell doesn't care about treating customers right, why should the peon agents?

                            Donald Trump should send some tweets and fix this with some regulations!
                            Last edited by 3WE; 2017-06-07, 22:16. Reason: Some rewording and embellishment.
                            Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by 3WE View Post

                              I guess if I had a 17th century violin, I'd be buying it a seat...
                              As would I, especially since UA (as most carriers) has a provision for just such an arrangement, and a violinist of such caliber as the lady in question likely is probably gets reimbursed for her travel expenses.

                              Comment


                              • The debarcle continues:

                                71 y/o man shoved to the floor for requesting a legible borading pass after security rejected the illegible one.

                                “I don’t think this is United specifically,” said Gary Leff, the author of the travel blog Viewfromthewing.com. “But U.S. airlines generally have not been good at screening for the best talent and screening out people who are not good at customer service.”

                                (or are pathological)

                                https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/14/t...-customer.html

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