The United debarcle

[3WE]

TeeVee makes that allegation that there's a little something EXTRA off in their FA culture...and sometimes I think it's true.

FA's from ALL airlines are frazzled from the nastiness they unrightfully endure from us and semi-unrightfully endure from the airlines operational rules and performance (and semi-rightfully endure), but sometimes there's a little bit more eye rolling in the AA stories as well as few personal instances that make you wonder if things are a little different and why they might be a little different...

[Evan]

AA FA's allegedly limit 11 total pax into 2 rows because they didn't buy second class tickets (and the virus-transmission implications are...)...

Shall we make bold proclamations as to what they should have done?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/american-...154308554.html

Seriously, let American go under. The world will be a better place.

Or better yet, bail them out (because we have no choice) with taxpayer money with the stipulation that EVERYONE gets to check a bag and reserve any available economy class seat for free for the next ten years. Why? Because now WE are the investors.

[3WE]

AA FA's allegedly limit 11 total pax into 2 rows because they didn't buy second class tickets (and the virus-transmission implications are...)...

Shall we make bold proclamations as to what they should have done?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/american-...154308554.html

[Evan]

Airlines are flying near empty flights just to keep the landing slots alive. YOU WOULD THINK a few phone calls would establish a waiver on this policy until the madness passes. But OH NO... like every other bureaucratic rock this virus has turned over, the system is ENTIRELY unprepared to deal with this CLEARLY PREDICTED scenario. Braaaavo. Enjoy the silence airline pilots. I don't know what to tell the environment...

[3WE]

Delta is waiving them, according to my inbox.

We can't cut them some slack, change fees are still legalized robbery and they are doing this just for PR optics. No problem with them putting a little price on it, but the normal fees....

/bitchy unappreciative customer.

[Evan]

In other news, Frontier is not waiving change fees for Coronavirus...(or is charging a $5.00 change fee depending on who you ask).

Delta is waiving them, according to my inbox.

[3WE]

In other news, Frontier is not waiving change fees for Coronavirus...(or is charging a $5.00 change fee depending on who you ask).

[Evan]

I'm willing to make an exception for SleazyJet flights out of Manchester. Beat the passengers as needed. Turn back as often as possible. This is perfectly justified.


https://edition.cnn.com/travel/artic...gbr/index.html

[Evan]

Things may be about to get a lot worse in Trump's Great Amerika. Say goodbye to your knees Gabriel.

https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2020-02-27/airlines-unfair-practices-rule

I'm especially entertained by the desccription of 'unfair'.

[brianw999]

Not only that, but in United they will not allow you change the seat category. It happened to me twice in flights between Houston and Argentina that there were seats available in the first row of the back "block" (which was also an emergency exit row). In fact, almost the full row was available (because they charge more for them, only those seats of that block are premium economy). After the doors closed I moved to that row and very quickly the flight attendant came with the POS device saying that they were delighted that I had chosen to upgrade the seat. I said something about the seat being not sold anyway and would not be sold so it would cost exactly zero, nada, zilch to United that I sat there to what she replied something like "Masters or Visa"? In both instances I moved back to my original seat. In one of the instances, another guy moved to that row already in flight as soon as the seatbelt signs were turned off. Again the smiling flight attendant came with the same intention. That guy was more "brave"than me so he insisted with the same kind of logic that I had tried and when that didn't work he said that he would just remain in that seat to what the FA said instructed him to either pay for the upgrade or move back to his originality assigned seat and reminded him that it was a criminal federal offense to disobey the instructions of the crew so if he decided to stay there without paying for the upgrade she would not fight him but the police would escort him out of the plane as we landed. Seriously, no joke.

On American, on the other hand, several times they allowed me to move to another standard seat that happened to be premium economy for is "geographic" location (front row or emergency exit) that happened to be empty. Even more, more than once I requested that seat at the counter of the gate and they told me to wait until the last minute, if they were not sold and nobody upgraded to it they would give it to me, and then they did give me the new boarding pass. It is a nice gesture that cost exactly NOTHING. My loyalty is much higher for American than United. Unfortunately the tickets to Argentina in American are hundreds of dollars more expensive than in United, which becomes thousands of dollars when you multiply by 5 (+wife + 3 children). So there is where my loyalty reluctantly goes back and down to United. But for the same price and even a tad more expensive? I would fly American over united every time. Not for 40% more per ticket (I could buy a premium economy in United for that difference and not depend on the generosity of the airline).

Of all the airlines based in America, United has to be the worst overall in just about all areas of their service. They treat you like they’re doing you a huge favour by carrying you. My favourite airline from the USA years ago was Continental. The tragedy with them was when United took them over.

[Gabriel]

reality check:

quite clearly you haven't flown recently or are flying some strange airline. almost every one of the nearly 100 flights i took last year--domestic and intl--was fully booked in both economy plus/first/biz. this includes AA, Copa, and Avianca. i also doubt VERY much that someone is gonna get a free upgrade because of discomfort.

Not only that, but in United they will not allow you change the seat category. It happened to me twice in flights between Houston and Argentina that there were seats available in the first row of the back "block" (which was also an emergency exit row). In fact, almost the full row was available (because they charge more for them, only those seats of that block are premium economy). After the doors closed I moved to that row and very quickly the flight attendant came with the POS device saying that they were delighted that I had chosen to upgrade the seat. I said something about the seat being not sold anyway and would not be sold so it would cost exactly zero, nada, zilch to United that I sat there to what she replied something like "Masters or Visa"? In both instances I moved back to my original seat. In one of the instances, another guy moved to that row already in flight as soon as the seatbelt signs were turned off. Again the smiling flight attendant came with the same intention. That guy was more "brave"than me so he insisted with the same kind of logic that I had tried and when that didn't work he said that he would just remain in that seat to what the FA said instructed him to either pay for the upgrade or move back to his originality assigned seat and reminded him that it was a criminal federal offense to disobey the instructions of the crew so if he decided to stay there without paying for the upgrade she would not fight him but the police would escort him out of the plane as we landed. Seriously, no joke.

On American, on the other hand, several times they allowed me to move to another standard seat that happened to be premium economy for is "geographic" location (front row or emergency exit) that happened to be empty. Even more, more than once I requested that seat at the counter of the gate and they told me to wait until the last minute, if they were not sold and nobody upgraded to it they would give it to me, and then they did give me the new boarding pass. It is a nice gesture that cost exactly NOTHING. My loyalty is much higher for American than United. Unfortunately the tickets to Argentina in American are hundreds of dollars more expensive than in United, which becomes thousands of dollars when you multiply by 5 (+wife + 3 children). So there is where my loyalty reluctantly goes back and down to United. But for the same price and even a tad more expensive? I would fly American over united every time. Not for 40% more per ticket (I could buy a premium economy in United for that difference and not depend on the generosity of the airline).

[pegasus]

Interestingly, I am told that if 10 people were to get together and rent a private jet to fly within Europe the cost per seat would not be much more than a scheduled airline business class seat cost.

More interestingly, 3WE, I am one of those polite travellers that asks the person behind me if it’s OK with them if I recline my seat.

ATL wrote.....I'll rephrase: what if the guy seated in front of Brian has herniated discs and will be in great pain if he does NOT recline? Why is Brian's pain the only one that matters?

Easily fixed ..... We swap seats. He can then recline to relieve his pain,

Gabriel wrote......I don't know what blame does Brian carry regarding his knee conditions and "size". But I have no control whatsoever over my height (and while I am higher than most, I a am not an outlier either. Being in about the 1% percentile you can expect a few of us on average in every flight.

I am just over 6 feet tall with an inside leg measurement of 32”. That creates the start of the problem in a 30” or less seat pitch but my personal issues are 34 years of working as a paramedic lifting and carrying the lame and lazy, working 12hr shifts which very regularly turn into 14hrs with a late call out, getting a 30 minute meal break if I am very lucky and eating fast food as result. Taking healthy food with me was not an option as we generally took our breaks on the run with no fridge availability.
As a result of this I suffer from bone on bone bilateral knee arthritis, am overweight and cannot exercise to lose weight so my orthopaedic surgeon refuses to give me new knees which would fix my problems at a stroke.

Half a lifetime devoted to public service ‘ain’t all its cracked up to be is it ?

May I commend to you Dr Sten Ekberg on YouTube. He has some interesting thoughts on nutrition and weight loss.

[TeeVee]

and, if that were not possible, to reseat you in premium economy or business class which is almost always available and, once the flight has departed, costs them nothing to offer.

reality check:

quite clearly you haven't flown recently or are flying some strange airline. almost every one of the nearly 100 flights i took last year--domestic and intl--was fully booked in both economy plus/first/biz. this includes AA, Copa, and Avianca. i also doubt VERY much that someone is gonna get a free upgrade because of discomfort.

[CarolW]

[QUOTE=brianw999;n1081272....
To all you youngsters giving me shit about my life issues I have one thing to say. One day you will get old. When that happens you will learn a valuable lesson hopefully.[/QUOTE]

And I hope you youngsters DO get old. Flying is so much safer than it used to be. Just don't expect a ride on my broom; it's not all that safe. And yes, I am old, and having those lessons.

[3WE]

Thank you but the quote is not mine.

Noted.

Your quote was the strawman argument that I don't have the right to run over a kid.

Much like Brian's comment, it is similarly "sweet".

Please spare us the ethics- it has NEVER been cool to run over a kid, but for most of history the social norm was to recline (if you want) except for takeoff and landing- no permission needed.

Take your campaign for peace, love and harmony elsewhere. I mean, it's a great idea and all, but this isn't the place to change the world.