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  • #76
    Originally posted by BoeingBobby View Post
    I was taken by an FAA inspector and as I said there were no cameras or phones allowed. Professionals? Not professional 747 drivers! Professional Government pawns!
    I don’t know about the FAA, and not wanting to sound naive, but we do give the NTSB credit for experience, professionalism and objectivity, don’t we ?

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    • #77
      Originally posted by 3WE View Post
      I can only think of one thing inside that particular area that would shove outwards....
      Pressurization?

      --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
      --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

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      • #78
        Originally posted by Gabriel View Post
        Pressurization?
        Ding ding ding, we have a winner! Tell the man what he has won Johnny.

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        • #79
          Originally posted by BoeingBobby View Post
          Ding ding ding, we have a winner! Tell the man what he has won Johnny.
          A tin foil hat!

          The report --of course-- factored in decompression as a cause of the propagation of structural failure following the initial "overpressure event":

          Originally posted by NTSB Report
          In addition to normal cabin pressurization loads, the accident airplaneís fuselage structure was subjected to loads from the venting of the WCS overpressure.
          What this comes down to is BoeingBobby's unscientific visual analysis of wreckage vs the detailed forensic findings of the NTSB's Metallurgy Structures/Sequencing Group. The latter detemined that the sequence was initiated by an overpressure event in the CWT. This was a CONCLUSION. The only thing left to speculation was the source of ignition. You can say it was a missile and I can't absolutely prove you wrong, but there is no vetted evidence to support that idea, it goes against logic and the evidence to support the electrical anomaly theory is very strong. But the CWT DID fail from "the inside out". It's all in the report:

          the Metallurgy Structures/Sequencing Groupís sequencing study concluded (in part because pieces from inside the CWT were among the first pieces to depart the airplane) that the initial event in the breakup sequence was an overpressure event 543 within the CWT and that the earliest piece of the airplane to be disturbed was SWB3. Specifically, the Sequencing Group concluded that SWB3 fractured at its upper end and that overpressure within the CWT caused it to rotate forward about its lower end. As the upper end of SWB3 rotated forward, it impacted the aft surface of the front spar, leaving distinct witness marks across most of the front spar. Analysis of the wreckage further indicated that when SWB3 impacted the front spar, it initiated multiple fractures along the upper chord of the front spar. Overpressure escaping from the CWT caused the front spar to bulge forward on either side of the two potable water bottles attached next to each other at the center of the front spar. The upper end of the front spar then completely separated from the upper skin of the WCS. After the upper end of the front spar was completely separated from the upper skin, the overpressure remaining within the CWT forced the WCS lower skin and the forward end of the keel beam downward. Downward loading of the forward end of the keel beam greatly increased the stress in the ring chord and in the fuselage skin adjacent to the front spar.

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          • #80
            And has nothing to do with having over 11000 hours flying the 747, 100, 200, 300, 400 and -8 and knowledge of the systems. You believe what you want to, it is certainly your right to have an opinion. But I would get in an old 100 series put a couple of hundred gallons in the center tank and not worry about a thing.

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            • #81
              Originally posted by BoeingBobby View Post
              And has nothing to do with having over 11000 hours flying the 747, 100, 200, 300, 400 and -8 and knowledge of the systems.
              Correct. Analysis of wreckage to determine structural failure sequencing of a fuel tank has nothing to do with that.

              Having thousands of hours in the field of engineering and being selected as a member of the NTSB's Metallurgy Structures/Sequencing Group should get you some respect though, don't you think?

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              • #82
                Originally posted by Evan View Post
                Correct. Analysis of wreckage to determine structural failure sequencing of a fuel tank has nothing to do with that.

                Having thousands of hours in the field of engineering and being selected as a member of the NTSB's Metallurgy Structures/Sequencing Group should get you some respect though, don't you think?

                Forget I ever mentioned it. You probably voted for Trump too.

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                • #83
                  All I want to know is....How do you fit this fuel tank into a carry-on baggage locker ? And, once there is it a safety issue ?
                  If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

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                  • #84
                    Originally posted by BoeingBobby View Post
                    You probably voted for Trump too.
                    No need for insults, especially that one. I'm just choosing to believe in the known facts. Trump voters believe whatever they want to believe.

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                    • #85
                      Originally posted by brianw999 View Post
                      All I want to know is....How do you fit this fuel tank into a carry-on baggage locker ? And, once there is it a safety issue ?
                      Post #45. Trying to make a point, but it went off the rails.

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                      • #86
                        Originally posted by brianw999 View Post
                        All I want to know is....How do you fit this fuel tank into a carry-on baggage locker ? And, once there is it a safety issue ?
                        Love it Brian!

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                        • #87
                          Originally posted by Evan View Post
                          No need for insults, especially that one. I'm just choosing to believe in the known facts. Trump voters believe whatever they want to believe.
                          The "alternative facts" is what you are choosing to believe in, which is why I figured you voted for him also.

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                          • #88
                            Originally posted by BoeingBobby View Post
                            That is a great idea Evan. You can be sure that everyone that even heard, let alone understood the flight attendants briefing, will abide by this and get off the aircraft in an orderly fashion. Especially when their passport, money and brand new MacBook Pro is in the overhead.
                            Once LittleBob said, he will not count his forum entries, numbers are completely unimportant. But as we all know, numbers do count. 2 goals (Denmark) are better than nada!
                            Back on topic. And welcome to the good side, the boring side, the "senior" side.

                            My opinion? - If a MacBook Pro is your one and only computer and you lose it because your life is more important for you, then you might seem like an idiot. But in real life, you are the hero, who ensures that a/c evacuation limit times can be fulfilled. For an A380, imho less than 90 seconds must be enough. And on German TV they showed that this is possible. But you jump out of the emergency exits as you are, without portable computers, of course.

                            As Evan says, for the unlikely case. Aviation is much safer than the way to the airport.
                            That's what airlines are good for, amongst others,
                            The Gold Member in the 747 club, 50 years since the first LH 747.
                            And constantly advanced, 744 and 748 /w upper and lower EICAS.
                            Aviation enthusiast, since more than 35 years with home airport EDDL.

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                            • #89
                              Originally posted by Gabriel View Post
                              Pressurization?
                              Dude- Not relevant (same to Bobby)...in my totally non expert opinion the bottom of the plane looks blown out...and much more blown out than 5 or whatever PSI it's carrying at 10k feet.

                              My parlour theory- the outer skin is blown out because the tank inside of it blew out...

                              One other comment- Bobby's insistence that the tank did not explode is awfully absolute...
                              Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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                              • #90
                                Originally posted by 3WE View Post
                                Dude- Not relevant (same to Bobby)...in my totally non expert opinion the bottom of the plane looks blown out...and much more blown out than 5 or whatever PSI it's carrying at 10k feet.

                                My parlour theory- the outer skin is blown out because the tank inside of it blew out...

                                One other comment- Bobby's insistence that the tank did not explode is awfully absolute...

                                Because Bobby has stood inside the reconstructed tank and has seen it with his own eyes. P.S. LH, "As Evan says, for the unlikely case. Aviation is much safer than the way to the airport." I said that not Evan.

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