Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

BREAKING: Boeing 767 cargo jet operated by Atlas Air has crashed in Texas

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Originally posted by BoeingBobby View Post
    Evan, answer the G.D. question!!
    I'll give you the same answer I gave ATL: this forum isn't about me or my type rating on the SR-71 converted freighter.

    This doesn't look to me like a loss-of-control due to weak piloting skills. It looks like something catastrophic (but I've been wrong about that before...)

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Evan View Post
      the SR-71 converted freighter
      That would be epic!

      Comment


      • #18
        The AVH article (updated since yesterday) includes this:
        In the late evening (local time) of Feb 23rd 2019 the Sheriff's office reported one body was recovered. Joint efforts by the Sheriff's office, the FBI and NTSB continue to recover the victims and the black boxes. The crash scene extends over a distance of 3 miles in shallow waters up to 5 feet deep. Multiple dive teams from the Baytown police, Houston police and Texas Department of Public Safety are working at the crash site.
        Now I tend to think that the 3 miles, if correct, may be due to debris floating and drifting due to wind/currents.

        The plane seems to have been in control until very near the end, with the altitude and ground speed slowly descending until at the last moments the ground speed reached it's all-time-low of 240 kts (I don't know the wind, but it seems too slow for an in-flight break up and to fast for a stall) and the sink rate increased to 7000 fpm.

        https://flightaware.com/live/flight/GTI ... H/tracklog

        --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
        --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Gabriel View Post
          *** ground speed reached it's all-time-low of 240 kts ***
          Flamingly unremmarkable. (As you say)

          I am leaning a bit to internal nut job sabotage.
          Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

          Comment


          • #20
            If I got anything wrong while trying to type this live, I apologize in advance.

            From the press conference. NTSB Chairman Robert Sumwalt is giving the press conference.

            Bill English is the investigator in charge.

            NTSB Go Team arrived last night.

            Atlas Air Flight 3591 contacted Houston at ~12:30PM. ATC told the pilots light rain was ahead and gave them radar vectors around the

            Cleared to descend to 3,000ft.

            12:39 is when communication was lost as was radar contact when the aircraft is at 6,000ft.

            Security video found of the crash from the Chambers’ County Jail. Video shows it in a steep, nose down attitude for about 5 second. Video will be analyzed by the NTSB.

            No distress call.

            Main wrecking is orientated in a NW direction.

            200 yards by 100 yards side

            Remains of both wings within the debris field.

            Landing gear parts are outside of the main debris field.

            Flight data recorders have not been found.

            The aircraft did not have any hazmat in the cargo.

            The FBI’s job is to collect witness statements and helping with evidence collection.

            Boeing and GE have representatives (among others) with the investigation.

            The NTSB will not be speculating as to the cause. That is what the investigation is for and will happen once all of the debris is collected.

            Questions:

            How much fuel was spilled?
            NTSB does not know at this time, but will know that later.

            How can an aircraft get into a steep nose dive very quickly?
            “We are there to figure that out.”

            How much time did the pilots have?
            Will be answered by radar data analysis and data recorder analysis

            Question on witness statements. He basically said witness statements are not always accurate.
            No evidence of aircraft trying to turn or pull up.

            Can the NTSB ID the crew?
            The NTBS will not identify the crew. That falls to the medical examiner.

            Question on CVR/FDR recovery.
            The data recorders may not be easy to find as the pingers may not work due to the mud.
            Might take dive teams and walking through the water, or dredging to find the recorders.

            Question on how long the NTSB will be on scene and how long the investigation will take.
            Until everything, especially the recorders, are collected. Investigation will take 12-18 months at least.

            Will the video be released?
            Yes, but not right away. It will be released with the rest of the evidence.

            From the Bryan Hawthorne, Chambers County Sheriff:

            Two bodies recovered, not IDed at this timed.

            Names will be released from the Sheriff’s office and/or the FBI, once the medical examiner makes confirmed IDs.

            The tide is out and make boat/barge operations more difficult

            From the FBI (missed the special agent’s name):

            FBI has asked for anyone with photos, videos, or if any debris landed on their property.

            FBI is doing all background investigations of the crew/passenger which is standard for this kind of accident

            People have already called in to provide photos, videos, and reporting debris.

            Sheriff chimed in to say there was not a large quantity of fuel just after the accident.

            Another press conference tomorrow at 4:00PM.

            Comment


            • #21
              ANAHUAC, Texas - A Mesa Airlines employee has been identified as one of the people aboard Saturday's deadly cargo plane crash.

              Captain Sean Archuleta was a pilot for Mesa since 2013, officials said. He was riding in the jump seat of the aircraft to travel to Houston to fly another aircraft, according to Mesa Airlines.

              https://www.click2houston.com/news/t...argo-jet-crash

              Comment


              • #22
                Mud is worse that water to collect the evidence. Would it be possible / sane to build a containment "wall" (even is just made of sand bags) around the 100 x 200 ft debris field and pump the 5 feet of water out? It's not so much water, like 10 to 20 Olympic-class swimming pool.

                --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
                --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Gabriel View Post
                  Mud is worse that water to collect the evidence. Would it be possible / sane to build a containment "wall" (even is just made of sand bags) around the 100 x 200 ft debris field and pump the 5 feet of water out? It's not so much water, like 10 to 20 Olympic-class swimming pool.
                  Both flight recorders from Valujet 592 were retrieved and read out, so there is precedent for hope.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    This was sent to me yesterday from one of the First Officers I used to fly with at Atlas. He says it was written by another Atlas pilot. True or not, it is written eloquently and with a deep understanding of what the life of a "Freight Dog" is like. Fair weather and tail winds my friends, I salute you.


                    “When a freighter goes in, the world by and large seems to go about its daily business, the loss of life is absorbed with seemingly little notice or mention.

                    For those of us who have lived and shared this life, this thing of ours, it can never be the case. The loss of of crew, friends, comrades, fellow sharers of the midnight struggles, the little victories between dusk and dawn against the weather and the clock, for us the loss is keenly felt.

                    For as safe, regimented, regulated, and as automated as this profession has become, there is still no ironclad guarantees against disaster.

                    We are involved in this business because we love this. There are easier ways to make a living, ways that don’t involve hurtling through the stratosphere at near sonic speeds, threading our way through weather and the night, while the rest of the planet sleeps below.

                    Every flight we make is a profession of faith, and an expression of love, whether we are chasing a dream deeply held, providing for a family, or just finding peace amid the high silence beneath the quiet gaze of the stars and the moon.

                    I will carry the memory of that Atlas crew with me onto the sky road this week, God bless and speed them, and give comfort to their families.

                    Words at times aren’t sufficient, they are sometimes all we have, but they aren’t enough.

                    Presence is required. Cheers to my brothers and sisters, love to you all, out.”

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by BoeingBobby View Post
                      “When a freighter goes in, the world by and large seems to go about its daily business, the loss of life is absorbed with seemingly little notice or mention.”
                      Yes, media and public attention is unfairly lessened when it's just the freight dog drivers that bite it.

                      Conversely, it sucks a bit more when a couple hundred folks behind the cockpit door are forced to sit there with no ability to help themselves and ride it out, especially when Internet blowhards are around that know that relentless pull ups sometimes cause stalls.
                      Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by 3WE View Post
                        Yes, media and public attention is unfairly lessened when it's just the freight dog drivers that bite it.

                        Conversely, it sucks a bit more when a couple hundred folks behind the cockpit door are forced to sit there with no ability to help themselves and ride it out, especially when Internet blowhards are around that know that relentless pull ups sometimes cause stalls.
                        Not really, the loss of one life is too many. You have proved the point of the letter to a tee! SMH

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by B757300 View Post
                          Stolen from another site. Haven't had time to listen to it; a little over 30 minutes.

                          ATC recording.

                          http://archive-server.liveatc.net/ki...2019-1830Z.mp3
                          Saw this mentioned on Twitter.

                          Listen to it when ATC received an "Ok" from the pilot. Instantly after the "ok" it sounds like there is a GPWS "PULL!" audible in the background. I've listened to it about 30 times (using ear buds) and it does sound to me like a "PULL" is heard, but maybe its a case of having the thought already planted in my head so I hear what I'm expecting. Occurs right around the 8:40 mark.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by B757300 View Post
                            Saw this mentioned on Twitter.

                            Listen to it when ATC received an "Ok" from the pilot. Instantly after the "ok" it sounds like there is a GPWS "PULL!" audible in the background. I've listened to it about 30 times (using ear buds) and it does sound to me like a "PULL" is heard, but maybe its a case of having the thought already planted in my head so I hear what I'm expecting. Occurs right around the 8:40 mark.
                            Yes, I can hear that... whatever that is. However, I can also hear similar sounds elsewhere in the recording, for example at 8:45.

                            --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
                            --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by BoeingBobby View Post
                              This was sent to me yesterday from one of the First Officers I used to fly with at Atlas. He says it was written by another Atlas pilot. True or not, it is written eloquently and with a deep understanding of what the life of a "Freight Dog" is like. Fair weather and tail winds my friends, I salute you.


                              “When a freighter goes in, the world by and large seems to go about its daily business, the loss of life is absorbed with seemingly little notice or mention.

                              For those of us who have lived and shared this life, this thing of ours, it can never be the case. The loss of of crew, friends, comrades, fellow sharers of the midnight struggles, the little victories between dusk and dawn against the weather and the clock, for us the loss is keenly felt.

                              For as safe, regimented, regulated, and as automated as this profession has become, there is still no ironclad guarantees against disaster.

                              We are involved in this business because we love this. There are easier ways to make a living, ways that don’t involve hurtling through the stratosphere at near sonic speeds, threading our way through weather and the night, while the rest of the planet sleeps below.

                              Every flight we make is a profession of faith, and an expression of love, whether we are chasing a dream deeply held, providing for a family, or just finding peace amid the high silence beneath the quiet gaze of the stars and the moon.

                              I will carry the memory of that Atlas crew with me onto the sky road this week, God bless and speed them, and give comfort to their families.

                              Words at times aren’t sufficient, they are sometimes all we have, but they aren’t enough.

                              Presence is required. Cheers to my brothers and sisters, love to you all, out.”
                              Nicely written.

                              --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
                              --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by BoeingBobby View Post
                                Every flight we make is a profession of faith, and an expression of love, whether we are chasing a dream deeply held, providing for a family, or just finding peace amid the high silence beneath the quiet gaze of the stars and the moon.
                                Amen.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X