Conservative Stronach joins Liberals

[AC888YOW]

You missed the whole point of my argument.... Mr. Harper is willing to toss out one of the best budgets in years which is valuable to all Canadians and simply jump into bed with the Bloc to further his own personal agenda...

It's a weak attempt though... as long as Harper is at the helm the Liberals will swing another minority... it's completely wreckless to go to the polls again.

No, I get the argument. Here's a little rebuttal for you:

simply jump into bed with the Bloc to further his own personal agenda...

So it's wrong when Harper does it but it's fine when Martin does then? That's what minority government is all about ... team up with whoever you can in order to further your agenda. After all, your agenda is the agenda of your constituents and it is your job to further that agenda. People who voted Conservative did so to try and help them form government, not the opposition.

Besides, what do you call Martin "teaming up" with the NDP on this budget? Seems like he's guilty of jumping into bed also, given that he's spent about a billion dollars a day in the last 2-3 weeks to gain the votes of the NDP. He's bribing you with your own money, you just don't see it. I guarantee if this was a Conservative budget you wouldn't be talking about how great it is ...

one of the best budgets in years

This "excellent budget" wasn't so excellent until about 2-3 weeks ago when Martin became desperate to save his a$$ and saw the only way of doing that was to bend over for the NDP. It doesn't matter if the budget is good or not ... the end doesn't justify the means.

it's completely wreckless to go to the polls again

I only wish we were going to the polls ASAP but alas unless some miracle happens tomorrow we won't be. Thievery, corruption, lieing and cheating will continue to prevail in this country. It is a sad time for Canada and Canadians.
________
Baha'i faith advice

[ACman]

it's completely wreckless to go to the polls again.

Exactly exactly. I am with Martin and the "Wait till after Justice Gomery gets is facts and its released to the Canadian public".

You want to know why J.R. is pushing so hard for the election? Because he knows once the sponsership scandle findings come out, he wont be respected as much and the voters will go back to the Liberals and trust them.

You missed the whole point of my argument.... Mr. Harper is willing to toss out one of the best budgets in years which is valuable to all Canadians and simply jump into bed with the Bloc to further his own personal agenda...

This budget is the best yet, even better than Malrouneys, god forbid the high GST.

Harper has a hidden agenda, he wants to kill healthcare plans. That guy has NO clue on how to run a country, and hes teaming up with the Bloc' only because they agree on one of his wacky "ideas".

This "excellent budget" wasn't so excellent until about 2-3 weeks ago when Martin became desperate to save his a$$ and saw the only way of doing that was to bend over for the NDP. It doesn't matter if the budget is good or not ... the end doesn't justify the means.

This budget was approved on all partys, hell Harpoon said it was a "good budget"...

It is a sad time for Canada and Canadians.

Its a sad time when we dont have free health care and ruin other perfectly good things because harpers excellent views. Its a sad day when your country is about to have the most advanced aircraft in the world for decades to come and the conservative leader decides to axe it because hes STUPID. Conservatives killed Canada. End story.

[Cam]

*clap* *clap* *clap* Wow, some good posts by the members

1) I'd like to see some proof of this "hidden agenda" you all talk about. The only people that talked about a "hidden agenda" are the Liberals.

2) The CPC was going to vote on the original budget, but the Liberals and the NDP got together and changed it.

3) This whole "anti-conservative" sentiment only comes from what you hear from the Liberals or what the CBC spits out at you. The CPC hasn't been in power so they DON"T HAVE A TRACK RECORD!!! DUHHH. And don't give this Mulroney sh!t, that was old politics in the 1980's. And give me some proof that he "killed" this country. I think we are a hell of a lot better of with NAFTA than we would have been without it.

The GST, well we could have kept the archaic Manufactures Sales Tax that was built into prices and was not separate....great for international business and foreign investment....

Chrétien, in the election campaign, promised to repeal the GST, which the Liberals had denounced so vociferously while it was the Official Opposition. Once in office, however, the Liberals discovered that the GST was all but essential if Canada were to erase its budget deficit and restore its economy.
From Wikipedia

Whadda ya know, it IS good for Canada.

I'm going to stop here because I'm sure I'm reaching the maximum level of intelligence of some members....

[Legend_Airlines]

This whole "anti-conservative" sentiment only comes from what you hear from the Liberals or what the CBC spits out at you. The CPC hasn't been in power so they DON"T HAVE A TRACK RECORD!!! DUHHH. And don't give this Mulroney sh!t, that was old politics in the 1980's. And give me some proof that he "killed" this country. I think we are a hell of a lot better of with NAFTA than we would have been without it.

Excellent point. I can't help but laugh when people blame Harper for cancelling the Arrow.

I guess we don't have any more military projects to cut, the Liberals axed 'em already. Guess we can still maintain our pride with old Norm in the canoe with his slingshot.

[yyz-yvr]

Should be quite interesting to see what exactly happens tomorrow evening, and just how everything plays out.

[avro_arrow_25206]

Excellent point. I can't help but laugh when people blame Harper for cancelling the Arrow.

I guess we don't have any more military projects to cut, the Liberals axed 'em already. Guess we can still maintain our pride with old Norm in the canoe with his slingshot.

We can't forget sex in the canoe courtesy of Pierre Berton. That's gotta be a killer sight, literally

John Diefenbaker's Progressive Conservatives are an entirely different entity than today's C party. Heck, it's not even progressive any more. So the Avro Arrow thing is definitely irrevelant. In any case, Diefenbaker is by far not the worst PM. Remember it was he who signed our first Bill of Rights.

Anyway, even if there is an election, it is unlikely the C will gain majority. Even as a minority in a coalition with the Bloc would be short of disaster. The Bloc is itself more towards the left. From the last campaign, I find that they agree in principle with the NDP, other than sovereignty of course. So I would expect it to fall in a jiff...
meh, we'll see what happens tomorrow

[A332]

So it's wrong when Harper does it but it's fine when Martin does then?

Martin has never approached the Bloc to make a deal, unlike Harper and his gang... I love how a federalist party is willing to give Quebec an even larger opportunity to separate, just as long as the man gets the throne... oh that does have serious consequences, by the way...

That's what minority government is all about ... team up with whoever you can in order to further your agenda. After all, your agenda is the agenda of your constituents and it is your job to further that agenda. People who voted Conservative did so to try and help them form government, not the opposition.

Since when do the Bloc and the Conservatives share any common agenda? The Bloc will take advantage of another election to ensure even more separatist MPs are in the house... the referendum won't be far off. Harper is merely using the opportunity to gain control, without considering the future state of our nation's affairs... you have the scratch deeper than the surface here.

Besides, what do you call Martin "teaming up" with the NDP on this budget? Seems like he's guilty of jumping into bed also, given that he's spent about a billion dollars a day in the last 2-3 weeks to gain the votes of the NDP.

The NDP and the Liberals share much common ground and can work rather well together... have you ever brushed up on your Canadian political history?

Oh, and the deal struck with the NDP was $4.6B in new spending... Martin's additional promises to the provinces have been separate deals. And if you think for a moment your pal Harper wouldn't be doing the same if he were in the same shoes, you're simply dillusional.

This "excellent budget" wasn't so excellent until about 2-3 weeks ago when Martin became desperate to save his a$$ and saw the only way of doing that was to bend over for the NDP. It doesn't matter if the budget is good or not ... the end doesn't justify the means.

hahaha... so you totally "forgot" about Harper's support for the budget as laid out by Ralph Goodale? Harper only changed his stance when a survey hinted that he could possibly slide a minority victory if he took down the government. I love how minds go blank so quickly!

I only wish we were going to the polls ASAP but alas unless some miracle happens tomorrow we won't be. Thievery, corruption, lieing and cheating will continue to prevail in this country. It is a sad time for Canada and Canadians.

We're saving $300M and getting some much needed work done, it's too bad the Conservatives enjoy wasting our time so often. Besides, as long as Ontario sticks with the Liberals, the Conservatives will remain the opposition... that isn't going to change any time sooon.

I'm going to stop here because I'm sure I'm reaching the maximum level of intelligence of some members....

Considering you never really threw much of anything of value on the table, I find it amusing that you would take such a "holier than thou" stance. By the way, how do you East Coast Conservatives enjoy the fact that Peter MacKay sold your respected party name to a bunch of redneck extremists from Alberta? You think you're ignored by the government now, just wait til the day Calgary runs the country...

[Da-BoB]

BRIBERY!!! thats why she moved.

also Liberals CAUGHT ON TAPE bribing 2 PC MP's

http://www.mytelus.com/news/article.do?pageID=canada_home&articleID=1931232

OTTAWA (CP) - A Tory MP says secretly recorded conversations with Prime Minister Paul Martin's chief of staff prove the Liberals offered him a plum patronage position for his co-operation during a confidence vote Thursday that will determine the fate of the government.
But the audio recording suggests Tim Murphy, Martin's top aide, urged Tory MP Gurmant Grewal and his wife and fellow Conservative MP Nina to abstain during the vote for an unspecified reward down the road.

The recording, released late Wednesday in the final hours before the vote, was the latest turn in what has been a tumultuous few weeks that has made predicting the outcome of Thursday's balloting perilous folly.

The liberals are all about Scandles Coruption and Bribery. Put them in power again and Canada will never be the same. The West will seperate and quebec will seperate. Don't belive it? well take the chance. 90% of people I know want to seperate. My dad has talked to a couple PC MP's that have said "if the liberals are in power after this vote I will go to the seperatist party of AB"

ITS ONLY A MATTER OF TIME

[Crazy764]

From CTV.ca

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1116459430183_5/?hub=TopStories

...Dosanjh convened reporters to give his own account of what transpired.

Dosanjh said he was approached on Saturday night by a mutual friend who said the Grewals would "cross the floor provided she gets a senate seat and he gets a cabinet post."

The minister said the two met over beer and pizza on Tuesday night, at which point he dismissed the suggestion as inappropriate and directed Grewal to take up the matter of switching political allegiance with Tim Murphy.

"I'm actually offended he couldn't take no for an answer," Dosanjh added, insisting that his party never offered any Conservative MPs anything to lure them over.

Grewal's allegation comes the day after Ontario MP Belinda Stronach left the Conservative benches to sit at the Liberal cabinet table.

Both Stronach and the Liberals have since denied suggestions she, or any other MPs, are being lured across the floor with promises of plum jobs or patronage appointments.

I'm not saying I believe or disbelieve either of the articles. But at this time, before we know the whole truth, let's not jump to conclusions.

[avro_arrow_25206]

I notice that many of the Tory supporters are using the Liberal's corruptions and scandals as the reason for their allegiance... but have any of those people thought about the Tory platforms and agendas? Clearly not as much attention is given to those, which should be the real reason why we support a cause.
Thinking in the long run, we don't make decisions in spite of something. We should be really focussing on the idealogies with which we agree (even though any promise from a politician doesn't mean anything )

[Da-BoB]

I notice that many of the Tory supporters are using the Liberal's corruptions and scandals as the reason for their allegiance... but have any of those people thought about the Tory platforms and agendas? Clearly not as much attention is given to those, which should be the real reason why we support a cause.

reasons to go PC
1. they aren't bribing people
2. they won't waste money on scandles
3. they treat the country different by province because not all of canada is the same
4. they belive in methods that cut tax
5. they have no hidden agendas

need I continue?
and yes I and many others have looked at the agendas of PC...

[avro_arrow_25206]

reasons to go PC
1. they aren't bribing people
2. they won't waste money on scandles
3. they treat the country different by province because not all of canada is the same
4. they belive in methods that cut tax
5. they have no hidden agendas

need I continue?
and yes I and many others have looked at the agendas of PC...

Points 1 and 2 are precisely what I said earlier -- they are merely in spite of the Liberal's flaws
3. Treating each province differently... how differently? Treat them as if they are separate nations?
4. Hopefully not too much for the corporations
5. We don't know yet... anyone can say anything at this stage

anyway, I'm not a Liberal supporter, in case you are wondering, but I just think many people are voting Conservative for the wrong reasons

by the way, it's no longer PC, just C now. I like PC more than the merged Conservative party

[A332]

Yup, there's a big difference in the original Progressive Conservative party and the current PC-Alliance merger that is the Conservative party...

The PC party was more centre-right, an area where many of us fall and no longer have a respective party to vote for... the Reform/Alliance whackos are extreme Alberta bred right-wingers with some pretty crooked ideology... Peter MacKay tarnished a perfectly good party by merging it with the fanatics.

I'll toss my vote to the Greens this time around... at least they can use the money!

[C-FZQS]

My favorite part of this was logging on to CTV.com and watching Peter Mc Kay in Nova Scotia. "I have'nt slept in two days"..... The whole interview made me laugh really hard. To me its propaganda, just to get a sympathy vote.

[A332]

My favorite part of this was logging on to CTV.com and watching Peter Mc Kay in Nova Scotia. "I have'nt slept in two days"..... The whole interview made me laugh really hard. To me its propaganda, just to get a sympathy vote.

Yeah, MacKay and Harper have both been recorded on camera with rather sad and pathetic statements on the matter... crybabies.