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  • #31
    This is what i am saying (not trying to argue iraq but merely using it as an example). What gives one country the right to decide what is and isnt murder, when murder is quite clearly an UNLAWFUL killing. Surely under the laws of many other nations, INCLUDING those of the nation where events took place, the killings were murder.

    This cant be decided absolutely, and therefore the teachings of the bible are modified and 'taken with a pinch of salt'. If Governments do this in these cases, why not with other teachings of the good book?
    I walked across an empty land
    I knew the pathway like the back of my hand
    I felt the earth beneath my feet
    Sat by the river and it made me complete

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    • #32
      The bible is as corrupted as could be. Anything that is written or interpreted by humans is bound to get distorted. Unless god him/her/itself handed me his/her/it's version of the bible, it wouldn't hold much merit to me.
      Earl From Regina

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Myblock
        The bible is as corrupted as could be. Anything that is written or interpreted by humans is bound to get distorted. Unless god him/her/itself handed me his/her/it's version of the bible, it wouldn't hold much merit to me.

        The Bible is not corrupted. . it is the word of God IMO. You're messing with the world's largest religion here! Also, about what Kat said, many things said in the Bible are not followed today because they were meant for the people described in the old testament. They were guidelines that those people were to follow in their civilization. However, most of the new testament is geared towards our followings today, and it is in the new testament that homosexuality is condemned.
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        • #34
          Originally posted by herpa2003

          The Bible is not corrupted. It is the true and inerrant word of God. You're messing with the world's largest religeon here! Also, about what Kat said, many things said in the Bible are not followed today because they were meant for the people described in the old testament. They were guidelines that those people were to follow in their civilization. However, most of the new testament is geared towards our followings today, and it is in the new testament that homosexuality is condemned.
          Is it not true though what MyBlock said about the bible being written down by man? And that anything touched by man is no longer in its purest form. Not to forget that so much of the NT was written BY man - the gospels, letters, etc. And after 2000 years man has had enough time to get his hands dirty, so to speak.

          This is not forgetting the fact that it was still written 2 millenia ago, and as we have established, society changes hugely in this time. Laws change daily, nothing written 2000 years ago can still apply to the letter.
          I walked across an empty land
          I knew the pathway like the back of my hand
          I felt the earth beneath my feet
          Sat by the river and it made me complete

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Katamarino
            Originally posted by herpa2003

            The Bible is not corrupted. It is the true and inerrant word of God. You're messing with the world's largest religeon here! Also, about what Kat said, many things said in the Bible are not followed today because they were meant for the people described in the old testament. They were guidelines that those people were to follow in their civilization. However, most of the new testament is geared towards our followings today, and it is in the new testament that homosexuality is condemned.
            Is it not true though what MyBlock said about the bible being written down by man? And that anything touched by man is no longer in its purest form. Not to forget that so much of the NT was written BY man - the gospels, letters, etc. And after 2000 years man has had enough time to get his hands dirty, so to speak.

            This is not forgetting the fact that it was still written 2 millenia ago, and as we have established, society changes hugely in this time. Laws change daily, nothing written 2000 years ago can still apply to the letter.
            True, the Bible was written down by men, but not just any man wrote it down. The scriptures claim to be "the very word of God" (Romans 3:2), written by men who were guided by the Holy Sprit (2 Peter 1:21). The human authors of the Bible regarder their writings as revalations from God (Exodus 24:3-4; Galations 1:12) and took great care in recording the words of God (Luke 1:1-4; John 21:24)
            Fly Raleigh-Durham International, with direct flights on Air Canada, AirTran, American Airlines, American Eagle, America West, Continental Airlines, Continental Express, Delta Airlines, Delta Connection, jetBlue, Northwest Airlines, Southwest Airlines, United Express and US Airways to:

            ATL, AUS, BWI, BOS, CHS, CLT, MDW, ORD, CVG, CLE, DFW, DTW, FLL, BDL, HOU, IND, LAS, LAX, LGW, MEM, MIA, MSP, BNA, EWR, MSY, JFK, LGA, ORF, MCO, PHL, PHX, PIT, STL, SLC, TPA, YYZ, DCA and IAD.

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            • #36
              THis may be true in isolated parts, but the whole of the gospels were not dictated by God. They were for the vast majority composed and interpreted by man. The same goes for Letters. Composed by man. And not to forget, TRANSLATED by man for the last 2000 years! Surely you dont believe that after even ONE translation of such a lengthy tome nothing would go unchanged, let alone 2000 years of the same.
              I walked across an empty land
              I knew the pathway like the back of my hand
              I felt the earth beneath my feet
              Sat by the river and it made me complete

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              • #37
                My Bible is composed of two books by aviation writer Assen Jordanoff.
                "Your Wings" - 1932
                "Through the Overcast" - 1936

                Very good books, essential read for the young aviators of today.

                -Clovis

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                • #38
                  Er, did GOD wrote that thing or HUMAN?

                  IF it's the Very Word of God. I think someone who copied God's words had an "human error" when writing those stuff down.


                  Originally posted by herpa2003
                  I am Christian myself, and i believe God gave us free will. What we choose to do with it is up to us - while many things are unacceptable in the eyes of God (killing for example) it still goes on, and sanctioned by our Governments as well. The law of God and the laws of the land are very different things.

                  The Bible clearly says homosexuality is "unnatural" and "indecent." Just look at Romans 1:26-32. Also 1 Corinthians 6:9-11.
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                  • #39
                    I must stress that this comment is NOT directed at anyone in particular on this forum. So with that, I shall begin...

                    1. I get sick and tired of people who use either 1. the Bible, 2. the Qur'an or 3. philosophers to back up an argument. People who do this IMHO use these works as a mental crutch because they cannot think for themselves.

                    Yes, use the the Bible as a source if you believe in it, but don't just tell us "well, the Bible says [insert Christian belief here]". Sure, tell us what the Bible's viewpoint is, but tell us in your own words and in your own reasoned argument why YOU believe something, not why God, or any of the blokes who wrote the scriptures believe(d) something.

                    And seriously, the Bible was not written in modern day English. Translation errors occur. How do you know that the Bible you are reading today is written as God intended? Also, how do you know that you are interpreting the Bible as God intended? And obviously there can be plenty of different intepretations of the Bible - that is why we have diversity between Catholics, Protestants, Baptists, etc., and then within each a subset of liberal and conservative intepretations. OK, OK, I hear y'all screaming "but they all agree that being gay is bad". We ll do they indeed? I think that the gay population of Christians around the world would disagree. Surely they have an interpretation that allows them to reconcile being gay with being Christian. And they all seem to think they're all on an express train to heaven, gay or not. This is cemented in fact by gay clergy being promoted to positions of power and influence in both British and New Hamsphire diocese last week. Surely both the priests in question and their superiors believe that the Bible and God him/herself have room for gay people.

                    The one thing I would say about the Qur'an, along with most of the hadiths, was that it was written during the life of the prophet. So, unlike the Bible, the person who 'heard the word of God' first hand actually saw the final version written down (or at least the vast vast vast marjority of it). The text (in sanscrit) has been probhibited from changing ever since. So the Qur'an you read today (and I'm not talking about the English translation) is as Mohammed proofread it, as it were. I am not claiming that the Qur'an is any more reliable a source, but it does not suffer from the corruption problem as much. That said, it still has the same interpretation and translation problems as the Bible. Again, look at the Islamic world - we had the Taliban who interpreted the Qur'an and the hadiths in a vastly different way to their Muslim colleagues in, say, Egypt. Or Turkey.

                    Now, philosophers. One thing I have to say about them is - who cares what a bunch of dead white men have to say about anything? Just because Kant thought up a bunch of stuff (possibly in a weed-induced haze, who knows?) does not make him right about anything!!!

                    So what is my bottom line? Never in an argument shall I accept anyone merely saying in total support of their contention "well, [the Bilbe/Qur'an/Kant] said x". Sure, use such as source as reference, but tell me why you believe x to be true. Go on, think for yourself. You might even enjoy it!
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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by herpa2003
                      The Bible is not corrupted. . it is the word of God IMO. You're messing with the world's largest religion here! Also, about what Kat said, many things said in the Bible are not followed today because they were meant for the people described in the old testament. They were guidelines that those people were to follow in their civilization. However, most of the new testament is geared towards our followings today, and it is in the new testament that homosexuality is condemned.
                      Word of whos god?

                      I often wonder what gives fundie christians the right to dictate that their particular firebrand of bullshit is the correct and best interpreted one.

                      As for special rights for gays and lesbians? All we ask is for equal rights.

                      Considering we're full taxpaying citizens, it's not of the governments or others business what we do behind closed door. Anal sex is hardly perverted or strange compared some practices.

                      Good to see this law overruled.



                      mb
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