New immagration bill

[AirRabbit]

The fact is that whenever anyone legally enters any country, his or her passport is stamped by the authorities of that country. That stamp proves that the person has entered the country legally. Of course, there are those who by-pass that process because of being a member of an airline crew (or something similar) – but, in such cases, the police and other officials are aware of those policies and an identification showing your employer would suffice. Each time I travel to another country my passport is stamped. I would expect that anyone entering the US legally would have the same experience.

And if you still aren't convinced ... try this link ... http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/8/12/II/VII/1304

We don't seem to have much tolerance in America for other cultures.

Well – two things … one – what kind of tolerant attitude should be exhibited toward someone in this country who is from another culture? Have you forgotten the US motto? E Pluribus Unum is Latin that means “from many – one.” That doesn’t mean “from many – many.” And, two … such a broad comment may be a bit “over the top” in that almost every US citizen is a descendant of persons not originally citizens of this country. Of course I acknowledge that it really too bad that some take little care in extending civil courtesies to those who visit here – and I imagine if their superiors were to see the level of rudeness that is often exhibited, those persons would be corrected.

[Deadstick]

Your talking Airports, I was referring to official Government offices. Apples, and oranges.

If you go to those same countries and try to Immigrate, and go to official offices to conduct business, ask if they will help get you English translations so you don't have to learn the language.

When I was stationed in Spain, even as a military member, I still had to learn enough Spanish to conduct any business I had at official offices. When I was stationed in Japan, I wanted a japanese license, not the military equivalent, because i wanted a Motorcycle. After I was fluent in Japanese and Kanji, they would let me take the test. Subsequently, I did not get a license.

To finish my story, I had just flown from Copenhagen to JFK. There were two older women on the flight that spoke no English. There were no multi-language signs at JFK to help them on their way to Customs. A police official started yelling at them to move along when they became confused as to where to go. Anyone that could read English could tell from the posted signs where they should go.

We don't seem to have much tolerance in America for other cultures.

I don't know if requiring others to speak a specific language to obtain rights and privilages is a good thing or not. Apparently you weren't allowed the simple pleasure and priviledge of riding because you couldn't meet some pretty tough rules in Japan. It would seem to me that riding a bike has nothing to do with whether you can speak Japanese and Kanji, but those in power to make that rule did.

[W7PSK]

I would only comment that in many European airports there are signs in multiple languages. Many Europeans also speak multiple languages and I find that communicating in English is frequently accomodated almost anywhere I go. I don't really have an opinion on whether there should be a national language for the U.S., as I'm apparently too stupid to learn another language myself. I know Russians and Czechs that speak better English than I do.

Your talking Airports, I was referring to official Government offices. Apples, and oranges.

If you go to those same countries and try to Immigrate, and go to official offices to conduct business, ask if they will help get you English translations so you don't have to learn the language.

When I was stationed in Spain, even as a military member, I still had to learn enough Spanish to conduct any business I had at official offices. When I was stationed in Japan, I wanted a japanese license, not the military equivalent, because i wanted a Motorcycle. After I was fluent in Japanese and Kanji, they would let me take the test. Subsequently, I did not get a license.

[twagenknecht]

One more thing...before posting to the forum, try running spell check. There are plenty of free ones out there...

[twagenknecht]

.....Americans do not speak English

Quite right. Most Americans have never learned English. Instead, they (we) have learned a bastardized form of the language. AND...there is also a general feeling that this is the only and best way of communicating to the rest of the world, failing to realize that Americans comprise a small percentage of the world's population.

[Deadstick]

Only observation
here in Washington they give drivers test in any language you want, if you don't speak American English they find an interpreter for you.

Every government office I go to the signs are primarily in 2 languages and they have assistance in a ton of others if needed.

I have to deal with a ton of different people and I find a lot of non-Natives have no idea what Im saying.

Schools are now teaching in 2 languages in some areas so as to not "Upset" the non-natives.

Its stupid. There has been many attempts to make English the national language and he ACLU, LaRaza et al all come out in force to make it go away.

I would only comment that in many European airports there are signs in multiple languages. Many Europeans also speak multiple languages and I find that communicating in English is frequently accomodated almost anywhere I go. I don't really have an opinion on whether there should be a national language for the U.S., as I'm apparently too stupid to learn another language myself. I know Russians and Czechs that speak better English than I do.

[W7PSK]

Now as to enforcement, reference?

Only observation
here in Washington they give drivers test in any language you want, if you don't speak American English they find an interpreter for you.

Every government office I go to the signs are primarily in 2 languages and they have assistance in a ton of others if needed.

I have to deal with a ton of different people and I find a lot of non-Natives have no idea what Im saying.

Schools are now teaching in 2 languages in some areas so as to not "Upset" the non-natives.

Its stupid. There has been many attempts to make English the national language and he ACLU, LaRaza et al all come out in force to make it go away.

[Simpleboy]

And "cheap labor" is no argument whatever for refusing to enforce the law. We have historically high unemployment. Why should all those jobs be done by illegals?

Hypothetically, if they work just as hard as each other and these are unskilled positions shouldnt the ratio of illegals to legals working such jobs be roughly the ratio of illegals to legals who apply for the job? But i bet you'll find they arent. I bet the applications for them are majority 'illegal citizens'.

So you may have high unemployment and many illegals working, but i bet if they (illegally staying people) were all evicted, you'd struggle to find the people to work all their jobs.

And as i said, this is hypothetical, i cant really provide numbers and if there were any i doubt they'd be reliable.

[EconomyClass]

I completely agree. Americans do not speak English. Aussies and Kiwis don't either. There's the Queen's English, then there's all these other languages. We should be acknowledging that the USA has had its own Anglo-related language for centuries. As soon that they gratuitously started using indigenous words, the language became unique. To me saying "English" is an anachronism. How do we expect Mexicans to learn a foreign language like English. And if they start talking Eastenders, how many of us would really understand that much better.

No, what they need to learn is American. And since everything seems to be cooked by them where I live (including Mongolian barbecue!) they seem to be doing it for the most part. But those who don't, won't,can't, done belong here.

And "cheap labor" is no argument whatever for refusing to enforce the law. We have historically high unemployment. Why should all those jobs be done by illegals?

[Deadstick]

Just discovered thanks to BK that I wasn't on the official USCIS site. So just to be sure I copied the requirements from the official site here:

Eligibility Requirements

To be eligible for naturalization under section 316(a) of the INA, an applicant must:

• Be 18 or older
• Be a permanent resident (green card holder) for at least 5 years immediately preceding the date of filing the Form N-400, Application for Naturalization
• Have lived within the state, or USCIS district with jurisdiction over the applicant’s place of residence, for at least 3 months prior to the date of filing the application
• Have continuous residence in the United States as a permanent resident for at least 5 years immediately preceding the date of the filing the application
• Be physically present in the United States for at least 30 months out of the 5 years immediately preceding the date of filing the application
• Reside continuously within the United States from the date of application for naturalization up to the time of naturalization
• Be able to read, write, and speak English and have knowledge and an understanding of U.S. history and government (civics).
• Be a person of good moral character, attached to the principles of the Constitution of the United States, and well disposed to the good order and happiness of the United States during all relevant periods under the law

Bolding done by me.

Now as to enforcement, reference?

By the way, before you think I'm some left wing softy on illegal immigration (definitely a lefty, but never soft) I lived in San Diego for 30 years and I know how bad the whole illegal immigration problem is. I was always amazed at how many illegals go to the trouble to cross the desert when all they had to do was go to the San Ysidro border crossing with a little money and claim they were going shopping for the day in Mission Valley. Then they can disappear at will. I consider our ridiculously porous border a very serious problem and would love to see a very stout cork shoved in the bottle, both north and south.

One of the problems is we need some of these workers. There's an enormous number of illegals that work the fields that we'd have an impossible time replacing with Americans or actual work permit people. I've been there. I actually worked the apple orchards of WA state in my youth and all of my coworkers were illegal, but Americans got their apples for cheap. And that goes for lettuce, strawberries, corn and any number of other hard labor foods we consume. Not to mention the large numbers of illegals that have helped to rebuild New Orleans and show up every two weeks to preen the yards of people that could otherwise do it for themselves or afford to pay a decent wage to someone with a legitimate reason to be here.

It's a much larger and more difficult problem than can be solved by the bloviations of the right wing entertainment media.

[W7PSK]

I believe reading, writing and speaking English is required as you can see above.

I stand corrected.

Too bad its not enforced.

[BoeingKing77]

I love when you press on that link,Deadstick,for the United States Citizenship Test,how this is on one thing:
Satisfaction Guaranteed
We stand behind the quality of our immigration products with a 30-day money back guarantee.

[Deadstick]

Because of our PC Bullstuff climate, we are not allowed to pick an official language. We are the only nation. AFAIK, If you try to Immigrate to any other non-English speaking country your required to speak the language. AND AFAIK, most other english speaking countries require you to learn the language to live there.

From the U.S. Immigration web site:

Definition of Citizenship: Citizenship is the status given to a legal member of the country. It involves rights, duties and privileges.

United States Citizenship: U.S. citizenship is usually acquired by birth when the child is born in the territory of the United States. This is provided under the 14th Amendment of the United States Constitution.

Naturalization: The process by which a citizen of a foreign country becomes a United States citizen. Order the US Citizenship Application Guide for more information.

Eligibility Requirements: All naturalization applicants must demonstrate good moral character. Other naturalization requirements may be modified or waived for certain applicants, such as spouses of U.S. Citizens, or individuals currently serving in the United States military.

Additional Citizenship Requirements Include:

• A period of continuous residence and physical presence in the United States
• The ability to read, write and speak English
• Good moral character
• Knowledge of the principles of the U.S. Constitution
• Favorable disposition towards the United States
• Ability to pass the United States Citizenship Test

I believe reading, writing and speaking English is required as you can see above.

[W7PSK]

Hmmmm .... funny thing is, that the United States don't have any "Official Language", at least at federal level. I'm not sure, if some states have an official language. You can call English as a de facto National Language, i.e. the most used language, but that's it.

Because of our PC Bullstuff climate, we are not allowed to pick an official language. We are the only nation. AFAIK, If you try to Immigrate to any other non-English speaking country your required to speak the language. AND AFAIK, most other english speaking countries require you to learn the language to live there.

[W7PSK]

About time. Now if the Fed would only Buck up to protect the over run at our borders and not try to figure out how to get 12 million new votes. Its funny if your caught being Illegal in Mexico you get an automatic Jail term. Here we give em Benefits and licenses and free health care.