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  1. Gross over-statement... I'm sure he THOUGHT...

    Gross over-statement...

    I'm sure he THOUGHT the runway would be right back...How is it you SEE the PAPI and then you don't see the PAPI.

    How many rainy approaches had he made where you briefly...
  2. What in the hell are you guys arguing about? I...

    What in the hell are you guys arguing about?

    I take Evan's 'assignment' of the instruments in a gray fuzzy manner...

    Either the PF THOUGHT 'watch the airspeed' MEANT that the other guy would...
  3. 1. Fixed. 2. Indeed. It appears that bad...

    1. Fixed.



    2. Indeed. It appears that bad CRM may be a significant issue here. Ideally someone's MOSTLY working the window, but frequently peeking at instruments, with someone else MOSTLY...
  4. As Gabieeee explained, a quick peek at the PAPI...

    As Gabieeee explained, a quick peek at the PAPI would also tell them they were below the glideslope when there was still time to go around.

    As Gabieeee also explained, a quick peek at the VSI, a...
  5. Who's relying on it? My guess is that PAPI's...

    Who's relying on it?

    My guess is that PAPI's are used two ways: 1) Kind of helpful when the ILS is out and you don't have something computer-generated. 2) A way to allow you to look out the...
  6. Such stuff generates fewer clicks...

    Such stuff generates fewer clicks...
  7. -It is linked to a cool, insider acronym. -It is...

    -It is linked to a cool, insider acronym.
    -It is linked to a specific, black and white (excuse me, red and white) procedure (as opposed to the broad fundamental concept that your altitude management...
  8. It has happened before...I'll leave it to you to...

    It has happened before...I'll leave it to you to come up with a mechanism. It might require some improvisational thinking.

    And where is your proof that there was no pilot error involved in this...
  9. Thread: I had no idea!

    by 3WE
    Replies
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    837

    Per usual, I see a near total dismissal the...

    Per usual, I see a near total dismissal the fundamental knowledge of Aviation and US history might be applied...The Wright brothers first flew in the early 1900's and air power was not really...
  10. Air molecules are fewer and farther apart. They...

    Air molecules are fewer and farther apart. They sometimes also weigh less, collectively.
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    One contributing factor is that the aircraft...

    One contributing factor is that the aircraft departed.
  12. I would speculate that it involves one or more of...

    I would speculate that it involves one or more of the causes usually involved in engine-failure-control loss crashes, with the final report possibly detailing what was and wasn't done and additional...
  13. Ok ALT, here we are with a textbook...

    Not uncommon with rotorcraft pilots.[/QUOTE]

    Ok ALT, here we are with a textbook outsider-insider moment.

    -Weather happens.
    -You are a commercial pilot
    -You have been flying commercially for...
  14. Ok...your point is that itís not that he was...

    Ok...your point is that itís not that he was lost, but Ďattitude disorientedí...I think.

    I believe the baseball player crash did involve some low ceilings- forcing him to fly low- but yes, his...
  15. Before or after we get the side-sonar destroyer...

    Before or after we get the side-sonar destroyer fleets with required recurrent training?
  16. A very inaccurate view. I DO have SOME...

    A very inaccurate view.

    I DO have SOME expertise in operating older 172s from smaller FBOs.

    IFR instrumentation and navigational stuff are questionable.

    The engine is going to have some...
  17. I'll give you this:

    I'll give you this:
  18. When did you try to make a point and when did I...

    When did you try to make a point and when did I argue against it?
  19. I see: -Attitude indicator -VOR/ILS -HSI...

    I see:

    -Attitude indicator
    -VOR/ILS
    -HSI
    -Radio Tuner

    I know that millennials aren't as good as Bobby or ITS at working that ancient stuff, but I repeat, slow down, climb, communicate,...
  20. This is not consistent with this ...

    This



    is not consistent with this



    Yes, Evan, reckless cowboy improvisation could be in play here.
  21. Indeed: "There would also have to be a...

    Indeed:

    "There would also have to be a recurrent training requirement"

    I would agree that it would be good if the rescuers could swim themselves.
  22. Ummm….okay...[snarcasm suspected] ...

    Ummm….okay...[snarcasm suspected]



    Ummm….OK...Writing specific requirements is a little bit pushy, especially if most facilities to have some sort of plan and equipment- even though you...
  23. For the record, I have never seen your original...

    For the record, I have never seen your original comments. Link perhaps?

    ALT, using exaggeration, indicates that they were rather overstated.
  24. Noted- but conversely, you apparently have a...

    Noted- but conversely, you apparently have a beachfront, commercial, transport-category airport without so much as a jon boat- not on the premises nor an agreement to borrow anything from the local...
  25. Indeed. However, Evan states in very black and...

    Indeed.

    However, Evan states in very black and white terms that the area had no water rescue at all whatsoever, and suggested a full fleet of high-speed rescue boats with a range of 300 miles,...
  26. No.

    No.
  27. IFR equipment aside, I BELIVE I heard some things...

    IFR equipment aside, I BELIVE I heard some things (reports of a radio call?) to the effect that the pilot was in mechanical distress and somewhat desperate to land?

    Most of the time, the weather...
  28. Ok Evan, I'll side with you that it [B]seems like...

    Ok Evan, I'll side with you that it [B]seems like they should get a good jon boat, outboard motor, a trunk full of life jackets and maybe even hit Amazon's pool and rafting sections for some life...
  29. Indeed. I often exaggerate to make a point. ...

    Indeed.

    I often exaggerate to make a point.

    But alas, getting you to acknowledge any shred of validity is almost impossible.

    Apparently not everyone agrees with your idea of a water-rescue...
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    Indeed.

    Indeed.
  31. It's all agronomical to me, but I have also...

    It's all agronomical to me, but I have also noticed that stuff that on the outside, that looked stupid and wrong, becomes very logical and correct when on the inside.

    And often we [no italics for...
  32. Did we leave?

    Did we leave?
  33. Replies
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    ...pilots who think that one should know...

    ...pilots who think that one should know procedures well, AND NOT forget fundamental aerodynamics either...that maybe relentless pull ups are bad, airspeed should be watched on short final (with a...
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    There, I quoted you verbatim. (There's probably...

    There, I quoted you verbatim. (There's probably another couple of key one liners I should snip out and add)

    That's essentially my whole point.



    Bingo. My point, Gabieee verbatim. I WILL...
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    Ok, Mr. Hair splitter. Correct, I am not quoting...

    Ok, Mr. Hair splitter. Correct, I am not quoting you verbatim. (Friendly razz, no anger)

    You said that six? crews were using much bigger control inputs when on alternate law- in particular in...
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    That's cute. Keep in mind they were hit by...

    That's cute.

    Keep in mind they were hit by lightning and had some sensitive electronic crap knocked out AND Gabriel is telling us that the handling was adversely affected...

    And, I guess...
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    The quick, flippant, and poorly-supported answer...

    The quick, flippant, and poorly-supported answer is "not made it worse". As to exactly how they should have done that, I don't know.

    I suspect Bobby, ALT or VNAV5 could have salvaged the landing....
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    "ONLY" Wrong. And not just because of the...

    "ONLY"

    Wrong.

    And not just because of the "absolute" rule.

    Let's go rent a 172. I'm out of practice, but have a damn good idea I can fly a stable approach and bounce the $hit out of the...
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    The lack of the bold font is again evidence of...

    The lack of the bold font is again evidence of your strong, black and white bias to predominately blame the pilots.

    Maybe you are "just quoting" someone else, but the omitted bold stuff is a big,...
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    1. Thank you. 2. a. Thank you. 2. b. Such is...

    1. Thank you.

    2. a. Thank you.
    2. b. Such is the stuff bounces are made of.
    2. c. And the spoilers didn't auto activate to suppress the desire of the (d.) really fast, (e.) lightly-flapped plane...
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