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BA 777 landing accident at LHR

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  • #16
    Fortunate? Id say that's about the biggest understatement you could muster up lol.

    Also any idea what that huge hole is from near the wing root on the wing? My initial guess would be landing gear strut being rammed up through the wing on landing? Or possibly something to do with the engine disintegrating.

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    • #17
      [photoid=6152406]
      [photoid=6152404]

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      • #18
        Originally posted by BA747-436
        Also any idea what that huge hole is from near the wing root on the wing? My initial guess would be landing gear strut being rammed up through the wing on landing? Or possibly something to do with the engine disintegrating.
        I'd say it was the gear strut puncturing the wing. Reports (and yes, I know how inaccurate those can be) all seem to indicate that the aircraft crossed the fence at an extraordinary high angle of attack, with the wings rocking back and forth. That's pretty indicative of being on the edge of a stall, which would be expected in this case. If both engines did indeed fail, it wouldn't take but a few seconds for all the drag from those huge flaps to take hold and decay the airspeed significantly.

        In that situation, you'd want to lower the nose to maintain whatever airspeed you had left, and aim for a touchdown (stall) just beyond the last major obstacle you'd really want to clear (in the case of a 27L approach, likely the perimeter road). If that's what the crew were trying to do (pure speculation on my part), they pulled it off as well as could be expected.

        The condition of the gear, and the fact that the aircraft stopped about 900ft from where it touched down, indicates that they touched down extremely hard, and had hardly any energy left when they did so. Thus my speculation that the hole in the wing is from the gear strut coming through.
        Trump is an idiot!
        Vote Democrats!!

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        • #19
          Id say your explanation sounds just about spot on. The high angle of attack coupled with the presumably low airspeed would be enough to do this damage and stop the plane relatively quickly. Perhaps if it had been able to make it to the runway (which may have not been such a good idea...) the aftermath would not have been so pretty? Asphelt coupled with a large impact of a metal structure and aviation fuel can be a messy concoction. . . So in this case landing on relativly soft grass area ahead of the runway could have been a contributing factor to the positive outcome of this mishap. I have to say that its also becomming apparant that the crew pulled off a minor miracle getting her down in one piece (or near enough) and with minimal casualties. Of course, what caused the total power outage will be interesting to discover and divulge. One must be thank full that this wasn't an aircraft made from a mostly composite material like those made by a competing company or the outcome of the condition of the aircraft on completion of its emergency landing may have been somewhat different .... Purely speculation on my behalf though
          Last edited by BA747-436; 2008-01-17, 18:26.

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          • #20
            As more and more info trickles through, its pretty obvious the passengers have been extreemly lucky, this could have been much worse.

            On a related note, can anyone help me work this comment out??:

            http://news.sky.com/skynews/picture_...172-16,00.html
            Last edited by turbotraker; 2008-01-17, 18:28.

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            • #21
              My first guess would be someone who has no idea what they are talking about. So basically anyone from a news station...

              My other guess would be someone with no clue about aviation trying to describe a 777 stalling.

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              • #22
                Cannot remember where (probably sky/bbc), I read that this jet 'may' have run out of fuel. Is that possible these days?

                I am not an expert but surely filght crew calculate weight/distance and take on enough fuel to cover plus a some spare. But can an aircraft actually run out of fuel??

                Murt

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by turbotraker
                  Cannot remember where (probably sky/bbc), I read that this jet 'may' have run out of fuel. Is that possible these days?

                  I am not an expert but surely filght crew calculate weight/distance and take on enough fuel to cover plus a some spare. But can an aircraft actually run out of fuel??

                  Murt
                  Of course it's physically possible to run out of fuel. But you would receive warnings indicating a fuel shortage before hand. Aircraft are only filled with a finite amount of fuel, and once you run out you become a glider.

                  However I am not suggesting that's what happened in this case.
                  Follow me on Twitter! www.twitter.com/flyingphotog

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                  • #24
                    I would be very surprised if it ran out of fuel. Although its a long flight from Beijing there should be a fair bit of fuel left for any sort of pattern hold that is required or a divert. If there was any hint of a fuel issue than I'm sure they would have put the aircraft down somewhere over northern Europe rather than 'wing it' (excuse the pun!) and try and get her home.

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                    • #25
                      And the positive aspects to this incident:

                      This showed the greatness of the crew. Had it not been for an experienced, well-trained crew, many of us would be offering our condolensces.

                      This also showed the greatness of the 777 - considering that this will be the first, hull-loss incident involving the type in it's majestic (and when considered - long) history!
                      Whatever is necessary, is never unwise.

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                      • #26
                        Begin Speculation Again --

                        I'd be surprised if landing on grass vs. landing on a concrete surface even entered the crew's mind. Basically, in a low energy power loss situation, you aim for the first suitable landing spot which, in this case, happened to be grass. Trying to "stretch" your glide in this sort of scenario, when not absolutely necessary, is taking a hell of a risk. You use the energy you've got to get to the closest safe landing spot, and not an inch further. Had the crew tried to make the runway, they could have easily lost just a bit more airspeed/intertia, and planted it into those row houses just prior to the perimeter road.

                        I'm sure, under ideal circumstances, the flight crew would have preferred to make the runway. Setting it down on concrete (in a controlled manner) has far less possible consequences than planting it in the grass, ripping off the gear, and careening through approach lights, signage, and other FOD on your way to a stop.

                        In the end, the crew made the correct decision -- sure, they broke the airplane, but nobody died, or was even seriously injured, and that's what is ultimately most important.
                        Trump is an idiot!
                        Vote Democrats!!

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by turbotraker
                          Cannot remember where (probably sky/bbc), I read that this jet 'may' have run out of fuel. Is that possible these days?

                          I am not an expert but surely filght crew calculate weight/distance and take on enough fuel to cover plus a some spare. But can an aircraft actually run out of fuel??

                          Murt
                          Of course an aircraft can run out of fuel. It's just like running out of fuel in your car, except it's obviously not just a case of 'pulling over' at the side of the road.

                          However It's been confirmed that there was enough fuel in the tanks for flight 038 to land safely so fuel starvation wasn't an issue.

                          Dale

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                          • #28
                            I'm not speculating or anything, but what 777 engines were supposedly having reliability issues? I remember there was the Malaysian 777 that shed some engine parts on takeoff about a year ago, and I believe there was a BA 777 with engine problems over the U.S. a few years back.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by JordanD
                              I'm not speculating or anything, but what 777 engines were supposedly having reliability issues? I remember there was the Malaysian 777 that shed some engine parts on takeoff about a year ago, and I believe there was a BA 777 with engine problems over the U.S. a few years back.
                              Bilo hit the button again....DAMNNIT!

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                              • #30
                                .....they could have easily lost just a bit more airspeed/intertia, and planted it into those row houses just prior to the perimeter road.
                                I was thinking about that. Can you imagine being a Myrtle Avenue resident and looking out of your back window to see that.

                                ....and now we await the tree-hugging, airports aren't safe, global warming crowd.
                                If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

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