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Thread: BREAKING: EgyptAir flight from Paris to Cairo has disappeared from radar

  1. #181
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    French investigators now upset with Egypt over the 'explosive' news
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/wo...aris-zgwqkcz6f

  2. #182
    Senior Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vaztr View Post
    French investigators now upset with Egypt over the 'explosive' news
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/wo...aris-zgwqkcz6f
    I suspect the FDR tells the tale. So let's have it out in the open! I think we cannot relegate these investigations to opaque cultures.

  3. #183
    Senior Member LH-B744's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ATLcrew View Post
    Sweet Queen Ka'ahumanu! When did they move Halifax to Europe?
    Hm. Will we become friends as long as you'll be here? I am on this platform since almost a decade, and I like to make it like AA 1818 or Brian, why not 13 or 15 years?!

    But you're right. Must be the language barrier. Not "in Europe". Let me try to correct that sentence, so that it pleases you.

    SR 111 for me was the last uncontrollable fire in a European long haul jet due to aircraft failure.

    And let me tell you in Atlanta Georgia, Switzerland for me is in the middle of Europe. I don't know if all jetphotos seniors of my age agree with that, but that'd be another discussion...

    At least, EgyptAir seems to be able to use
    a) an aircraft that is able to fly the distance nonstop
    b) calculate fuel for international flights.

    Which is not the case for all topics that we discuss in 2016 (Viru Viru) ...
    One evening, not long ago, I watched TV and I wondered what you will possibly do after you've lost one parent. Strange question, why did I wonder. You will possibly be annoyed because he will miss so many happenings which you liked to show him. But after you somehow have regained your countenance, you will also join again people who you don't know. Stay strong, Jimmy.

    Aviation enthusiast since more than 30 years.

  4. #184
    Senior Member LH-B744's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    I suspect the FDR tells the tale. So let's have it out in the open! I think we cannot relegate these investigations to opaque cultures.
    I don't use every link that is presented here, so, although it again seems like a respectable newspaper, I like to write what I think, concerning the BEA for example.

    I trust the BEA, especially since 2015. And imho, this office should have the same connection to all Airbuses worldwide as

    the NTSB has to all Boeings worldwide.

    So, I have not all details on my screen, isn't the BEA again involved? That'd be my wish.

    PS: The Canadians have published a list of nationalities. 1 Canadian was on board. Which is tragic, because I almost could feel the thoughts before he or she booked the flight. MS-A320, why not? It is a Star Alliance bird, OUR alliance. Perfect, I'll be on board.

    + 15 French passengers. + CDG. That encourages me, the BEA should solve this case. They know how to work, they've shown it in 2015. This is the list:
    globalnews (Canada) publishes nationalities in MS 804

    The FDR.... since May 2009 we know that this might take a few weeks... But I'll be here.

    Today, there is one man that shouldn't be worried about 'his a/c type'. One of the fifty fireworks is from me. Congrats.
    Last edited by LH-B744; 12-16-2016 at 06:22 AM. Reason: Also always helpful (!): the Canadians.
    One evening, not long ago, I watched TV and I wondered what you will possibly do after you've lost one parent. Strange question, why did I wonder. You will possibly be annoyed because he will miss so many happenings which you liked to show him. But after you somehow have regained your countenance, you will also join again people who you don't know. Stay strong, Jimmy.

    Aviation enthusiast since more than 30 years.

  5. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by LH-B744 View Post
    Hm. Will we become friends as long as you'll be here? I am on this platform since almost a decade, and I like to make it like AA 1818 or Brian, why not 13 or 15 years?!

    But you're right. Must be the language barrier. Not "in Europe". Let me try to correct that sentence, so that it pleases you.

    SR 111 for me was the last uncontrollable fire in a European long haul jet due to aircraft failure.

    And let me tell you in Atlanta Georgia, Switzerland for me is in the middle of Europe. I don't know if all jetphotos seniors of my age agree with that, but that'd be another discussion...

    At least, EgyptAir seems to be able to use
    a) an aircraft that is able to fly the distance nonstop
    b) calculate fuel for international flights.

    Which is not the case for all topics that we discuss in 2016 (Viru Viru) ...
    Seriously, just post in German.

  6. #186
    Senior Member Evan's Avatar
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    I can't help wondering if this is somehow related:

    http://avherald.com/h?article=48bd8b94&opt=0

    I also can't help wondering whatever happened to the investigation...

  7. #187
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    Today's statement from Egypt seems deliberately misleading, they categorize the event as an accident and confirm conversations of fire in the cockpit and fdr smoke indications, at the same time saying the event occurred (suddenly and catastrophically?) at 37000 feet causing the fdr to stop recording and that a criminal investigation is underway. They seem to be making contradictory cases for both the intentional and accidental causes without clarifying either.
    moving quickly in air

  8. #188
    Senior Member Gabriel's Avatar
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    http://avherald.com/h?article=4987fb09&opt=0

    On May 22nd 2017 Egypt's Civil Aviation Authority released following statement indicating the investigation currently is in the hands of Egypt's Public Prosecutor:

    After the repair of the electronic boards of the aircraft recorders and conducting several intensive tests; the result came as positive as it showed the possibility of reading the recordings of the two memory units.

    The members of the Technical Investigation Committee returned to Cairo with the boards to continue work and reading the contents of the recorders as well as analyzing them at the laboratories of the Ministry of Civil Aviation of Egypt. After the FDR data were uploaded and examined by the experts; the results indicated that the flight data had been recorded since the departure of the plane from Charles de Gaulle Airport until it stopped at 37000 thousand feet where the accident occurred. The recorded data of the recorder matched the Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System (ACARS) messages which indicated smoke in the lavatory and smoke from the avionics compartment. When the CVR data was unloaded, conversation at the cabin prior to the accident at was heard, which mentioned the word fire.

    Consequently the Technical Investigation Committee made a chronological linkage between the data extracted from FDR and the voices recorded on CVR.

    In the meantime; John Lethbridge recovered all the human remains that were spotted at the crash location; in the presence of Egyptian and French forensic experts on board. As the Egyptian government was keen to ensure that all human remains are recovered and that it stands in solidarity with the families of the victims, it was decided to extend the mission of John Lethbridge for two additional periods, to conduct a new scan of the seabed and to search for any other remains until it is fully ascertained that there are no human remains at the crash scene.

    The human remains of the victims were handed to the Public Prosecutors and to accredited representatives of the Egyptian forensic medicine institution; in the presence of members of the Technical Investigation Committee and the Egyptian and French forensic doctors. Immediately the human remains were transferred to the Egyptian forensic medicine institution in Cairo in order to carry out the standard measures.

    In September 2016; the Central Department for Aircraft Accident Investigation at the Ministry of Civil Aviation received reports of the forensic Medicine of the Arab Republic of Egypt; concerning the bodies of the victims; which indicated finding traces of explosive materials in some human remains. Reference to Article No. (10 of the Civil Aviation Law No. 28 for the year 1981, and its amendments; which provides that in case the Technical Investigation Committee suspects the existence of any criminal act behind the accident, it shall inform the public prosecution and therefore the Technical Investigation Committee had referred the matter to the public Prosecution; while availing its expertise under the disposal of the public prosecution. Noteworthy; investigation is still in progress by the Egyptian public prosecution.

    --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
    --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

  9. #189
    Senior Member Evan's Avatar
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    The BEA has to open their own investigation. Certainly there is enough evidence to establish more than this. The Egyptian authorities are either incompetent or withholding information, or both. If there is a potential fire vulnerability on certain Airbus aircraft, Airbus needs to know about it.

  10. #190
    Senior Member LH-B744's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    The BEA has to open their own investigation. Certainly there is enough evidence to establish more than this. The Egyptian authorities are either incompetent or withholding information, or both. If there is a potential fire vulnerability on certain Airbus aircraft, Airbus needs to know about it.
    Yes. I think that's one of my earlier entries concerning this topic. The BEA is one of the only very few institutions who still have 100% of my trust.

    Airbus = BEA, Boeing = NTSB? Since March 2015, I think, this is a parallel. And since March 2015, I am probably not the most prominent pilot/JP member who is interested in
    LH-A320 topics...

    Since December 16th, 2016, I can't think of another pilot, who'd better fit into this position... Why? Because I am old school. I am still convinced of a Boss who is able to teach the apprentices all that they have to know to be ...
    a Lufthansa Flight Captain.
    One evening, not long ago, I watched TV and I wondered what you will possibly do after you've lost one parent. Strange question, why did I wonder. You will possibly be annoyed because he will miss so many happenings which you liked to show him. But after you somehow have regained your countenance, you will also join again people who you don't know. Stay strong, Jimmy.

    Aviation enthusiast since more than 30 years.

  11. #191
    Senior Member LH-B744's Avatar
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    ...And I am still convinced of companies where the company is older than the CEO (and not vice versa!): United Airlines, NYT, Condor Flugdienst and...

    and one very unimportant operator of B744s and B748i's ...

    PS: If "we" weren't interrupted by this insane Austrian import, LH would celebrate 91 years in aviation in 2017, together with UA. Keyword: 747 Prototypes, LH: 47 years and counting. UA: 47 years.

    Only 2 of the reasons why the 747 once was developed still are in the air tonight, since 1970? LH and UA. 47 years, that's almost the half of
    100...
    If there is one wish that I have for the future, CEO Munoz was 10 years old when the first UA-B747 was inaugurated. And I was 11 years old when the first LH-B744 was inaugurated.

    Thus, I wish that LH and UA together celebrate 50 years of 747 in worldwide service, since 1970. Qantas flies the 747 since July 1971, so, I dream of two 747 meetings, at, of course, the SF Bay Intercontinental airport.
    2020: 50 years of 747 for LH and UA.
    2021: QF should join "us".

    Sometimes, dreams come true.
    Last edited by LH-B744; 05-25-2017 at 03:43 AM. Reason: 747 Prototypes. 50 years of worldwide service.
    One evening, not long ago, I watched TV and I wondered what you will possibly do after you've lost one parent. Strange question, why did I wonder. You will possibly be annoyed because he will miss so many happenings which you liked to show him. But after you somehow have regained your countenance, you will also join again people who you don't know. Stay strong, Jimmy.

    Aviation enthusiast since more than 30 years.

  12. #192
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    BBC report says there is a very deep trench in the Mediterranean where the plane went down. Makes me wonder: How long will the locator beacons sound off this time? They stopped way too early with AF447. Still 30 days?

  13. #193
    Senior Member Gabriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarutok View Post
    BBC report says there is a very deep trench in the Mediterranean where the plane went down. Makes me wonder: How long will the locator beacons sound off this time? They stopped way too early with AF447. Still 30 days?
    It's irrelevant for this crash. The flight recorders were already recovered. Some airplanes parts were recovered. The exact location of the wreckage is known already.

    If you ask in general, yes, the requirement is still 30 days.

    --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
    --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

  14. #194
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    Does anyone know if the made any manouveres like course or altitude adjustment just before the hard turn reported by the greeks ?

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    Wow... if that proves to be true, there are going to be some huge impacts! Which I suppose probably goes without saying.

    Some of the language in the article is pretty funny though:
    "...caught fire after being plugged into the wrong socket." Ah... so the guy plugged his stuff into the "catch fire" socket when he should have plugged it into the "do not catch fire" socket?

    And...
    "Cockpit plugs are not made for toasters or coffee pots. " Noted... but in this case it doesn't sound like anyone plugged in a toaster or a coffee pot.
    Be alert! America needs more lerts.

    Eric Law

  17. #197
    Senior Member 3WE's Avatar
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    OK...but that's not particularly consistent with the supposed facts of a fairly sudden aircraft-disabling event.
    Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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