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Thread: Someone Dies from Jet Blast in St Maarten

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    Default Someone Dies from Jet Blast in St Maarten

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ort-st-maarten

    I've always wondered if anyone ever got seriously hurt on that beach especially with those concrete barriers.

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    Super Moderator brianw999's Avatar
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    I have no sympathy for the deceased at all. I feel sorry for her relatives and the emergency service personnel who have to tidy up the results of such lunacy.
    If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !


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    Senior Member 3WE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brianw999 View Post
    ...lunacy...
    Who doesn't love getting close and personal with big powerful things? And folks have clung to the fence for years (yeah, sure, it may cause imperfections in your photos, but to witness such sheer power.)

    We watch trains, we chase tornadoes, we go rafting in swift water, we go to car races and get killed by flying tires.

    Sure, there is a magical distance behind (and ahead of, for that matter) a jet engine where you might be over powered, but repeating, folks are hanging on to that fence every day...

    ...especially people who like airplanes (not that that there's all that many folks like that around here).

    Edit: By the way, it would be interesting to review the stats of St. Maarten Fence clinging to parachuting. I know over the last 10 years, the total death count from parachuting is a lot higher...now normalized to the number of fence clingers vs. jumpers???...who knows. Still, I can't be quite so harsh on fence clingers when people jump out of perfectly good airplanes.
    Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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    Senior Member Gabriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3WE View Post
    Who doesn't love getting close and personal with big powerful things? And folks have clung to the fence for years (yeah, sure, it may cause imperfections in your photos, but to witness such sheer power.)

    We watch trains, we chase tornadoes, we go rafting in swift water, we go to car races and get killed by flying tires.

    Sure, there is a magical distance behind (and ahead of, for that matter) a jet engine where you might be over powered, but repeating, folks are hanging on to that fence every day...

    ...especially people who like airplanes (not that that there's all that many folks like that around here).

    Edit: By the way, it would be interesting to review the stats of St. Maarten Fence clinging to parachuting. I know over the last 10 years, the total death count from parachuting is a lot higher...now normalized to the number of fence clingers vs. jumpers???...who knows. Still, I can't be quite so harsh on fence clingers when people jump out of perfectly good airplanes.
    Parachutes have specialized equipment, protocols, procedures, training, instructors, experience, parachutemanship (sometimes), and back-ups. Fence clinging is sheer improvisation.

    --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
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    Senior Member 3WE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel View Post
    Parachutes have specialized equipment, protocols, procedures, training, instructors, experience, parachutemanship (sometimes), and back-ups. Fence clinging is sheer improvisation.
    That does not change the statistics of total deaths in the last 10 or 20 years. I think we have a real problem with parachute deaths.

    And I dare say that the fence clinging checklist is heavily laden with very simple, obvious fundamentals. What else is needed but 1. Hold tight. And 2. Consider what the best action is should you let go IDEALLY DO THIS BEFORE STEP # 1.

    Admittedly, the cowboy improvisers tend to skip step #2, but hey, let's look at the death toll from relentless pull ups too. Fence clinging wins again!
    Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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    Super Moderator brianw999's Avatar
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    I've done some dangerous things in my life but there were training needs and safety precautions to take. SCUBA dove past 50 metres but used the appropriate Tri-mix of breathing gases and used a very conservative dive plan backed up with a dive computer. Raced karts, the proper 140 mph rocketships, not the putt putt tourist type but wore leathers and a very expensive crash helmet with added neck padding. Rode motorcycles but wore the proper gear and drove according to road conditions and within the law...well, mostly !
    So, compare those exhilarating activities to fence riding. No safety clothing, rely on hand grip to avoid going airborne, background consisting of rocks and high concrete kerbs.

    Like I say, Lunacy !
    If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !


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    Quote Originally Posted by brianw999 View Post
    I've done some dangerous things in my life but there were training needs and safety precautions to take. SCUBA dove past 50 metres but used the appropriate Tri-mix of breathing gases and used a very conservative dive plan backed up with a dive computer. Raced karts, the proper 140 mph rocketships, not the putt putt tourist type but wore leathers and a very expensive crash helmet with added neck padding. Rode motorcycles but wore the proper gear and drove according to road conditions and within the law...well, mostly !
    So, compare those exhilarating activities to fence riding. No safety clothing, rely on hand grip to avoid going airborne, background consisting of rocks and high concrete kerbs.

    Like I say, Lunacy !

    You have heard of the Darwin awards? She is the winner for the week!

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    Quote Originally Posted by brianw999 View Post
    I have no sympathy for the deceased at all. I feel sorry for her relatives and the emergency service personnel who have to tidy up the results of such lunacy.
    You must've had a remarkable life to have never made a mistake.

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    Senior Member Gabriel's Avatar
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    What was the mistake? I see no mistake.
    Obviously she didn't grab she didn't stand behind the plane by accident. It was intentional.
    And there are very clear signs that say that you can get badly hurt or die by doing this.
    Also, the family of the victim declared that they knew the risks.
    They DECIDED to take a known risk, and the risk realized. I see no mistake.

    --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
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    Super Moderator brianw999's Avatar
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    PeteJ. Trust me, I have made plenty of mistakes. I just steer clear of the ones that are likely to kill me. (Edit: I can't see the bit where I claimed to have never made a mistake. Perhaps you could point it out to me. Thank you.)

    Gabriel. Dying while doing something that you have been seriously warned not to do sounds pretty much like a mistake to me ! They took a known risk. They disobeyed a written instruction not to "surf the fence" Oh yes, nearly forgot. Their travel insurance company won't pay a rusty penny to the family and any life insurance could also be quite probably nullified. That will help the family won't it ?

    As Bobby says....the Darwin Awards winner of the week.

    https://youtu.be/cT1yvqcDZZw
    Last edited by brianw999; 07-18-2017 at 03:55 PM.
    If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !


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    Senior Member Gabriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brianw999 View Post
    PeteJ. Trust me, I have made plenty of mistakes. I just steer clear of the ones that are likely to kill me. (Edit: I can't see the bit where I claimed to have never made a mistake. Perhaps you could point it out to me. Thank you.)

    Gabriel. Dying while doing something that you have been seriously warned not to do sounds pretty much like a mistake to me ! They took a known risk. They disobeyed a written instruction not to "surf the fence" Oh yes, nearly forgot. Their travel insurance company won't pay a rusty penny to the family and any life insurance could also be quite probably nullified. That will help the family won't it ?

    As Bobby says....the Darwin Awards winner of the week.

    https://youtu.be/cT1yvqcDZZw
    I believe we have very different definitions of what's a mistake. Something that you do intentionally knowing the potential consequences is not a mistake in my dictionary. In your dictionary, would it have still been a mistake if nothing bad have happened as a result of that decision and action?

    That you later regret having done something (if you survive it, of course), doesn't make it a mistake. "It was a mistake robbing that store and killing the owner. Now I have to spend the rest of my live in prison". Mistake my arse. That is a crime. We are abusing the word "mistake". If not, everything that we do bad is downplayed to just "a mistake".

    --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
    --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

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    Senior Member 3WE's Avatar
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    Noted:

    Thread evolves into a bicker session on whether Brian makes mistakes or not and a bicker session on how Brian defines mistakes with near zero acknowledgement that experiencing a good (though not deadly) level of jet blast might be kind of a cool experience for an aviation fan.

    Carry on.
    Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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    Not the best video, but some brief clips at 0:25 and 2:30 for the sake of relevance. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plwwy0kv_HI
    Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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    Senior Member Evan's Avatar
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    Well, she can cross that off the bucket list...

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    I visited SXM this Easter. It seems to me that the tourist industry round the island encourages this stupidity. There is a ready supply of T-shirt with slogans such as "I've been blown..." available. Cruise liner companies decant the contents of up to five large vessels on some days and ship their content over to Maho Beach to "get blown". Some friend who "do cruises" told me that their company described this activity as the thing to do on Sint Maarten. That's a pity because it's a pretty little island. While I was there nobody was hanging onto the fence as in the video above but many thought it fun to stand in the jet blast that pushed them into the sea.

    I think too highly of my cameras to participate in this lunacy.

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    David W. Wilson

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    Senior Member 3WE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aldgyte View Post
    ***I think too highly of my cameras to participate in this lunacy.***
    Yes, horsepower and airmanship and sounds and maneuvering to address the winds is so boring.
    Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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