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  • #16
    Re: Airbus haters come in here!

    Originally posted by screaming_emu
    I dislike airbus because I am a pilot and I enjoy flying aircraft. Flight crews are turning into system monitors rather than pilots.
    Has been that way for the last 30 years. Unless your talking about the little planes you guys are flying in school.....automation is required. If a pilot had to fly an airliner for much more then takeoff and landing the passengers would revolt! You cannot fly a plane as smooth as a gyro.

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    • #17
      Re: Airbus haters come in here!

      Originally posted by JeffinDEN
      Originally posted by screaming_emu
      I dislike airbus because I am a pilot and I enjoy flying aircraft. Flight crews are turning into system monitors rather than pilots.
      Has been that way for the last 30 years. Unless your talking about the little planes you guys are flying in school.....automation is required. If a pilot had to fly an airliner for much more then takeoff and landing the passengers would revolt! You cannot fly a plane as smooth as a gyro.
      While this is true, I do believe there is such thing as too much. I'm not saying get rid of autopilot. Handflying a plane for 14 hours from IAH-NRT would suck. But I dont think that the aircraft should do everything for you.

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      • #18
        Re: Airbus haters come in here!

        Originally posted by screaming_emu
        Originally posted by JeffinDEN
        Originally posted by screaming_emu
        I dislike airbus because I am a pilot and I enjoy flying aircraft. Flight crews are turning into system monitors rather than pilots.
        Has been that way for the last 30 years. Unless your talking about the little planes you guys are flying in school.....automation is required. If a pilot had to fly an airliner for much more then takeoff and landing the passengers would revolt! You cannot fly a plane as smooth as a gyro.
        While this is true, I do believe there is such thing as too much. I'm not saying get rid of autopilot. Handflying a plane for 14 hours from IAH-NRT would suck. But I dont think that the aircraft should do everything for you.
        I wonder if the ultimate goal of the people in Toulouse is to eliminate the pilot completely and retain just a radio link for remote control in case human interaction is required.
        With their current automation levels such would quite likely be possible.

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        • #19
          This has been done already as well. The Navy has been flying planes via data link for decades as well. We do need someone to start the engines and taxi to the catapault. After that it CAN be a hands off flight, all the way back to the boat. Round trip.

          Launch is hands off. Vectors to target via data link/AFCS = Hands off
          Weapons release via AWACs=hands off.
          Vectors back to ACLS radar via data link/AFCS = hands off
          ACLS (automatic carrier landing system) to an O.K. three wire = Hands off

          The pilot would need to move the throttles to cut off.

          Flying upside down to take pictures of "Bogies" = Pilot required... :P

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          • #20
            Coolcc. First off, when making any post you want other members to take seriously, I would suggest better grammar and punctuation. Second, a purpose for posting a topic that is intelligent an informative would also help. As much as I grin about people chatting about where an airline will fly next, or why doesn't Chalks Int'l buy 747-400s on floats, these topics do serve a purpose for those folks who do find this type of thing interesting. Third, I would seriously consider getting a new screename, as most folks in here will not read or take seriously any further posts or threads by you.

            That being said, think before you post. There is no sense in making inflammatory statements as you have here. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and in many cases, it should be kept to yourself.

            Mark Twain once said that it is better to refrain from arguing with a fool, as a passerby may not be able to tell who's who.

            Cheers!
            Bite me Airways.....

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            • #21
              He is 13.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by JeffinDEN
                This has been done already as well. The Navy has been flying planes via data link for decades as well. We do need someone to start the engines and taxi to the catapault. After that it CAN be a hands off flight, all the way back to the boat. Round trip.

                Launch is hands off. Vectors to target via data link/AFCS = Hands off
                Weapons release via AWACs=hands off.
                Vectors back to ACLS radar via data link/AFCS = hands off
                ACLS (automatic carrier landing system) to an O.K. three wire = Hands off

                The pilot would need to move the throttles to cut off.

                Flying upside down to take pictures of "Bogies" = Pilot required... :P
                I wouldn't feel comfortable flying in a plane flown entirely by computers...

                The human factor, I think, is necessary in a psychological way, since not too many people would like to fly a plane with no pilots.

                I'd rather have a human pilot in the cockpit than trusting my life to a fallible bunch of chips.


                A Colombian guy moved by the winds of fate to St. Louis, MO

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by LRJet Guy
                  or why doesn't Chalks Int'l buy 747-400s on floats, these topics do serve a purpose for those folks who do find this type of thing interesting.
                  Speaking of which...

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by JeffinDEN

                    Flying upside down to take pictures of "Bogies" = Pilot required... :P
                    I wanna try that in the practice area someday

                    In all seriousness, the airforce also has been flying "remote control" planes as lately in both Afghanistan and Iraq.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Flying High
                      I wouldn't feel comfortable flying in a plane flown entirely by computers...
                      It's amazing, but them damn trains that whiz around the airport seldom have a "pilot" and everyone thinks they are great.

                      Besides...they can't figure out how to get the computers to join the union...so I think pilots are safe for a while.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by JeffinDEN
                        Originally posted by Flying High
                        I wouldn't feel comfortable flying in a plane flown entirely by computers...
                        It's amazing, but them damn trains that whiz around the airport seldom have a "pilot" and everyone thinks they are great.

                        Besides...they can't figure out how to get the computers to join the union...so I think pilots are safe for a while.


                        A Colombian guy moved by the winds of fate to St. Louis, MO

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                        • #27
                          Oh yeah, Screaming Emu...

                          While maintaining basic stick and rudder skills is important for all pilots, automation makes life a lot easier. While I agree that pilots should handfly when they can, there are times when it is just impractical, cruise flight being one of them. When flying passengers, smoothness is important, and without the autopilot working, that may be difficult to acheive in some cases. The Lears that I fly all have horrible autopilots, so we handfly the majority of the time, and use the autopilot for cruise when it works. The thin atmosphere flown through in cruise makes the airplane very touchy to any control input, and you will find chasing the airplane if you blink for more than a second. I notice a huge difference when above FL370. When people are walking around in the back, that makes life even more miserable.

                          Flying the piston aircraft down low, descent planning is practically done for you. With a jet flying in the high altitudes, there is a lot of work to be done to do it correctly. With ATC handing out crossing and speed restrictions, you have to be on the ball since an early descent will cost you dearly in fuel burn.

                          If the automation available is used properly, and to its fullest, than the pilot's workload is greatly reduced, therefore the safety of flight is greatly increased. So is the economids of the aircraft. You will understand more about this as you progress through your flying career, and step into bigger and faster aircraft. You sound to me like the kind of person who will do well when flying these airplanes, as you will have a respect for flying the aircraft without the autopilot, and most likely learn the ropes of navigating without the automated devices that many aircraft are equipped with.
                          Bite me Airways.....

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                          • #28
                            I think at least in the near future (say 30 years or so) pilots will be in the cockpit. There are things that will always need a human's judgement. Such as when you're taking off and bambi decides to run accross the runway, or you're flying along and see a large flock of birds and decide to avoid them. As well as deciding whether the thunderstorms are too close together to fly between or not. Also in emergencies computers cannot be "creative" like deciding to use differential thrust to get the aircraft where it needs to go after an engine failure blows out all 3 hydraulic systems.

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                            • #29
                              I know unpiloted flight is possible and has been demonstrated in quite large aircraft. But at the moment it is illegal for airliners, I wonder whether AB wants to silently make it so the airlines go push for being allowed to scrap that most expensive person in their daily operations in favour of higher bonusses for their CEOs...

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by jwenting
                                Call me oldfashioned, but I prefer metal beneath my feet ...
                                To bad then you never will fly on the 7E7


                                Originally posted by jwenting
                                I know unpiloted flight is possible and has been demonstrated in quite large aircraft. But at the moment it is illegal for airliners, I wonder whether AB wants to silently make it so the airlines go push for being allowed to scrap that most expensive person in their daily operations in favour of higher bonusses for their CEOs...

                                Why just AB would want that ???

                                The B777 also use Fly by Wire and is in the theory ready for Unpilot Flights!!

                                And im sure if Airbus or Boeing offer that one day the Airlines would jump on it like you say Pilots are expensiv.
                                Freundliche Grüße / Best Regards / Atentos saludos / Meilleures salutations

                                Michael Bogensperger
                                ==================================================

                                Airlinerpictures.net



                                My Photos at Jetphotos.net

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