Airplane Crash over Tripoli

[Dream_In_Flight]

Now where do you put the 777 at Heathrow, the Air France in Toronto, the Airbus in the Hudson, or even the Airbus in the trees in Toulouse? Among the "old & overbuild" or the "new & weak" ones.

Gabriel, I fully agree with your rationale. As I know from reading your frequent posts that you are very much into details, I just want to remind that the Airbus landing/crashing in trees took place at Mulhouse Habsheim Airfield (LFGB), approx 360 NM north east of Toulouse.

Of course, I'm not blaming anyone here. I would be myself in big trouble to name any city of Argentina beyond Buenos Aires, and even more in trouble to locate them on a map !

Just making a little promotion for tourism in France: Both Mulhouse and Toulouse areas are both lovely places to visit.

Hasta luego

[Gabriel]

Thanks for your correction.

[Gandalf123]

What does that mean? I can conform with 100% certainty that they were below the MDA just prior to the crash.

Yes, Gabriel. Most planes do go below MDA just prior to crashing....

[Peter Kesternich]

Yes, Gabriel. Most planes do go below MDA just prior to crashing....

Make that "ALL planes do go below MDA just prior to crashing..."

[Gabriel]

Yes, Gabriel. Most planes do go below MDA just prior to crashing....

Well, I'm happy that you got the intent of my ironic sentence.

[Peter Kesternich]

False. Midair collisions.

Touché...

[Deadstick]

Touché...

Not so. The collision happens wherever, but the impact with the ground is the crash, ergo, below the MDA.

[brianw999]

It 'aint the fall that kills you....

....it's the sudden stop at the bottom !!

[EconomyClass]

After reading a Pravda account of the Tripoli crash, I'm wondering: Why does sun in the pilot's eyes matter? They don't fly by vision do they? Aren't they watching instruments that show altitude and attitude of the plane? I'd find it more credible if the instruments were giving them faulty readings than that they misjudged altitude because "we lost the runway in the sun".

[3WE]

After reading a Pravda account of the Tripoli crash, I'm wondering: Why does sun in the pilot's eyes matter? They don't fly by vision do they? Aren't they watching instruments that show altitude and attitude of the plane? I'd find it more credible if the instruments were giving them faulty readings than that they misjudged altitude because "we lost the runway in the sun".

Indeed and Concur.

By the way, I have a strange shaving question.

[MCM]

EC,

Its very difficult to land on a runway if you can't see it!

The only time you can use the instruments for navigation until touchdown are on specially approved ILS approaches, and with the autopilot engaged, of which this was not one.

Landings are most definately done by vision. 95% of them at least.

[EconomyClass]

EC,

Its very difficult to land on a runway if you can't see it!

The only time you can use the instruments for navigation until touchdown are on specially approved ILS approaches, and with the autopilot engaged, of which this was not one.

Landings are most definately done by vision. 95% of them at least.

Cool. And when the sun blinds you? What then?

[SYDCBRWOD]

Cool. And when the sun blinds you? What then?

What do you in a car when driving directly into the setting sun?

[ultraflight]

What do you in a car when driving directly into the setting sun?

You crash into a parked police car, as I did once!
It's not just the direct blinding of the sun, but the windscreen lights up, especially when it's scratched or slightly fogged or dirty.

[3WE]

You crash into a parked police car, as I did once!
It's not just the direct blinding of the sun, but the windscreen lights up, especially when it's scratched or slightly fogged or dirty.

Now this has gotten interesting. Extra Cluless's comment "why do they need windows?" was incredibly off base...BUT...

Could they have had an extra bad experience with the sun in their eyes?

But with ultraflight's angle, Extra Clueless has some points....if you briefly lose sight of the runway, do you have radar altitude (or the regular altimeter) to keep your situational awareness up and not hit the cold hard ground?....

If you are "critically low" do you dutifully shovel more coal to the engines and go around, or do you give it another second or twooh$hit! (I know that's "not procedure" and hard to believe that top-of-the line pilots would do such, but humans make mistakes)

Is this the one-in-a-zillion incident where the sun "blinds" the pilots and they botch the landing and break the plane?

Or, maybe they ran out of gas.