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lol nowadays I think it's the opposite: flight attendants are rude to passengers
Hello Mr Leo 747. What is funny about flight attendants being rude, please? I have absolutely no sense of humour, as all who know me will attest, so can you please spell it out for my dull wit?
Actually, I have only had good experiences on American based airlines (Delta, Northwest, Continental, Alaska).
When it comes to rudeness, nothing beats Lufthansa
Hello Mr Kesternich. I've not had the pleasure of rudeness in the air yet. I was intending to make a booking for my next flight with Jet, but now am wondering if Lufthansa might not be more rude and thus more interesting. Please say more about your experience; did they shout at you, refuse reasonable requests, ignore pleas for assistance etc?
Well - so far, all Lufthansa staff I have encountered, both in the air and on the ground, were arrogant and condescending, treating me like they would let me travel with them out of pure grace and making me feel like I had to thank them for allowing me the privilege of being on board one of their flights... Only the flight crews I met and talked to have been decent and friendly.
Well - so far, all Lufthansa staff I have encountered, both in the air and on the ground, were arrogant and condescending, treating me like they would let me travel with them out of pure grace and making me feel like I had to thank them for allowing me the privilege of being on board one of their flights... Only the flight crews I met and talked to have been decent and friendly.
I don't travel Lufthansa if I can avoid it...
They are not arrogant they are professional. That is why I like them. Air Berlin for example has a more relaxed attitude, but when it comes down to needing their service, I go LH every day.
I'm not sure there's any empirical data to support your claim. However, assuming what you say is true, here are some considerations:
1. America was founded on - amongst other things - the value of personal liberties, including the right to privacy, and the freedom to travel between states. In few other domains do we find these liberties trod upon so gratuitously as in air travel.
2. The typical airline passenger is accustomed to the service industry treating him or her as always being in the right. Such is not the case anymore with airline travel.
3. Sense of entitlement - both passengers and flight attendants feel that they are hard done by, or have the right to all manner of privileges, and these interests often compete.
4. America is not a society of manners in the way that the UK is, so right off the bat they are disadvantaged by such a comparison. Perhaps there is a tradeoff, though?
5. Pay for service. When you pay for an airline ticket, there is an implicit expectation of what that purchase will entail, including a modicum of service and hospitality. At least in these parts.
And so on. It's a bit like comparing apples and oranges - cultural differences play a large role.
Hello Mr Fear of Flying,
I think there is some confusion about the issue of anger (what you call 'rudeness') in the relationship between you as a passenger and the professionals who fly the plane and attend your needs for nourishment and care whilst aboard the aircraft. I will try to impart a little simple information to explain this relationship a little more clearly for everyone on this thread.
For humans, early relationships affect very strongly every other relationship you have for the rest of your life. If you wish to understand the origins of anger and its resolution in relationships between passenger and flight attendant, then you need to understand your own relationship with your mother, firstly, and then with your father and finally with your siblings if any. The most significant relationship for any human is with the main early nurturer, your mom. If your mom was an angry woman who did not allow the necessary play and boisterousness in the little Mr Fear of Flying, or little Mr Jingogunner, then we will have become frustrated by the time we reach adulthood. If mom is punishing and short-fused, we will be irritable passengers. This irritation will be further triggered every time someone is rude to us. If our flight attendant also hails from an angry mom they will have additional stress to cope with because of the emotionally demanding work they do. A flight attendant whose needs as a child were better met will not respond so readily to an irritable passenger, nor will they be seeking an outlet on someone more vulnerable.
When little Mr Jingogunner was frightened, he often ran to mom for comfort and safety. When adult humans are frightened, or even nervous, they unconsciously (remember that word, unconsciously) revert to looking round for mom. And there she is! Mom! The airline pays a pretty and well-dressed young woman to be Mr Jingogunner's mom, or, a smartly dressed young man to be dad when he is frightened at the noise of the engines, the movement of the craft through the air, the unnatural sensation of flight which primates like Mr Jingogunner and Mr Fear of Flying feel so uneasy with. So we begin to bleat, please can I have another drink (another bottle of milk please, mommy), I'm hot, can't you turn the Ac on higher, please mommy?, I'm cold, please can I have a blanket , please read me a story mommy, I can't sleep. If the flight attendant is a bloke, then the regressing and nervous Mr Jingogunner will develop, unconsciously, the same sort of relationship as he had with his father. The more negative his relationship with either parent was, the more negative will be Mr Jingogunner's response to the flight attendant. Using this information, can you see how air rage, road rage, wife beating, rape, assault and other crimes of violence originate in an individual? Many is the time I listened to people who told me how they loved their mom, she taught them right from wrong but that when they slapped their wife she 'asked for it'. This negative relationship with mom has been made unconscious for reasons I can explain if anyone specifically asks. Other negative relationships causing spiteful, ungrateful and spoiled passengers, as I'm sure any Flight Attendant will agree, is the passenger whose mom and dad spoiled them by catering to every whim and who now, as adults, demand instant gratification which nobody could ever satisfy. To return to our aircraft, we can now see clearly how an attendant who is tired, has experienced irritation and unhelpful comments from several frightened and irritable pax over a time span of two, three or 6 hours, will respond inappropriately and contrary to their training when confronted by a passenger whose wrapper is seriously evaporating.
In the US, a major childbeating nation where children's' basic primal needs are increasingly ignored and even brutishly punished, a majority of children are growing up on a short fuse, although they will invariably tell you they was raised proper. When flight stresses arise, the parent/child relationship between passenger and cabin staff is highlighted according to the degree of fear/ stress evoked by the flight, and a confrontational incident again arises. Many passengers will try and pretend they are not nervous which compounds their negative responses.
If airlines listened to those advocating common sense and education, they could implement a training programme dealing with these root causes of bad behaviour, with providing better response training to help staff work with anxious passengers to reduce air rage incidents. Instead, they have tightened the rules and encouraged authoritarianism as a style of interaction with passengers, which creates more stress. The greedy anxious individuals who own and mange airlines are unable to learn and change very easily unless they can see obvious profit.
Last edited by Jingogunner; 2012-03-26, 12:33.
Reason: spelling
Hmmmmm.. interesting attitude... In my opinion, if a person working in the service sector treats a customer so that he feels unwelcome, this is UNprofessional...
Hmmmmm.. interesting attitude... In my opinion, if a person working in the service sector treats a customer so that he feels unwelcome, this is UNprofessional...
Well, they are not the best in making you feel welcome, but I like them for always being correct and formal in what they do. With LH you never get the feeling that they are happy that you are flying with them, but you also never get the feeling that they absolutely hate you for bothering them. And if I needed the service at LH, they always performed very well and efficient.
I think there is some confusion about the issue of anger (what you call 'rudeness') in the relationship between you as a passenger and the professionals who fly the plane and attend your needs for nourishment and care whilst aboard the aircraft. I will try to impart a little simple information to explain this relationship a little more clearly for everyone on this thread.
For humans, early relationships affect very strongly every other relationship you have for the rest of your life. If you wish to understand the origins of anger and its resolution in relationships between passenger and flight attendant, then you need to understand your own relationship with your mother, firstly, and then with your father and finally with your siblings if any. The most significant relationship for any human is with the main early nurturer, your mom. If your mom was an angry woman who did not allow the necessary play and boisterousness in the little Mr Fear of Flying, or little Mr Jingogunner, then we will have become frustrated by the time we reach adulthood. If mom is punishing and short-fused, we will be irritable passengers. This irritation will be further triggered every time someone is rude to us. If our flight attendant also hails from an angry mom they will have additional stress to cope with because of the emotionally demanding work they do. A flight attendant whose needs as a child were better met will not respond so readily to an irritable passenger, nor will they be seeking an outlet on someone more vulnerable.
When little Mr Jingogunner was frightened, he often ran to mom for comfort and safety. When adult humans are frightened, or even nervous, they unconsciously (remember that word, unconsciously) revert to looking round for mom. And there she is! Mom! The airline pays a pretty and well-dressed young woman to be Mr Jingogunner's mom, or, a smartly dressed young man to be dad when he is frightened at the noise of the engines, the movement of the craft through the air, the unnatural sensation of flight which primates like Mr Jingogunner and Mr Fear of Flying feel so uneasy with. So we begin to bleat, please can I have another drink (another bottle of milk please, mommy), I'm hot, can't you turn the Ac on higher, please mommy?, I'm cold, please can I have a blanket , please read me a story mommy, I can't sleep. If the flight attendant is a bloke, then the regressing and nervous Mr Jingogunner will develop, unconsciously, the same sort of relationship as he had with his father. The more negative his relationship with either parent was, the more negative will be Mr Jingogunner's response to the flight attendant. Using this information, can you see how air rage, road rage, wife beating, rape, assault and other crimes of violence originate in an individual? Many is the time I listened to people who told me how they loved their mom, she taught them right from wrong but that when they slapped their wife she 'asked for it'. This negative relationship with mom has been made unconscious for reasons I can explain if anyone specifically asks. Other negative relationships causing spiteful, ungrateful and spoiled passengers, as I'm sure any Flight Attendant will agree, is the passenger whose mom and dad spoiled them by catering to every whim and who now, as adults, demand instant gratification which nobody could ever satisfy. To return to our aircraft, we can now see clearly how an attendant who is tired, has experienced irritation and unhelpful comments from several frightened and irritable pax over a time span of two, three or 6 hours, will respond inappropriately and contrary to their training when confronted by a passenger whose wrapper is seriously evaporating.
In the US, a major childbeating nation where children's' basic primal needs are increasingly ignored and even brutishly punished, a majority of children are growing up on a short fuse, although they will invariably tell you they was raised proper. When flight stresses arise, the parent/child relationship between passenger and cabin staff is highlighted according to the degree of fear/ stress evoked by the flight, and a confrontational incident again arises. Many passengers will try and pretend they are not nervous which compounds their negative responses.
If airlines listened to those advocating common sense and education, they could implement a training programme dealing with these root causes of bad behaviour, with providing better response training to help staff work with anxious passengers to reduce air rage incidents. Instead, they have tightened the rules and encouraged authoritarianism as a style of interaction with passengers, which creates more stress. The greedy anxious individuals who own and mange airlines are unable to learn and change very easily unless they can see obvious profit.
Well, next time I get a bristly waitress at a restaurant, I'll just have to remember that her mother probably didn't let her play with dolls growing up. Actually, Big Mr. Fear of Flying doesn't impose such a Freudian interpretation on the banal actions of daily life. I'm sure a flight attendant and customer are both capable of overcoming their early childhood trauma and feigning an occasional smile.
With LH you never get the feeling that they are happy that you are flying with them, but you also never get the feeling that they absolutely hate you for bothering them.
Tell me though..........why are most of those found on American based airlines ?
Now now... these things people say about Americans are just like when people claim all lawyers are crooks. It's not true of all of them, it's just a certain subset of each group that's making the other 1% look bad!
Hmmmmm.. interesting attitude... In my opinion, if a person working in the service sector treats a customer so that he feels unwelcome, this is UNprofessional...
Indeed, it is not professionally acceptable behaviour, Mr Kesternich. However, can you explainwhy people behave unprofessionally? Are they failing to notice something, perhaps, or, have they had no awareness training in what to look for in themselves, what to identify as in the passenger's behaviour?
Is there a similarity here to explaining how accidents happen, how errors are made?
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