Malaysia Airlines Loses Contact With 777 en Route to Beijing

[EconomyClass]

If it turns out to be suicide, what will airlines do to insure someone with suicidal tendencies doesn't turn his personal problem into a massacre? What can they do?

[Peter Kesternich]

If it turns out to be suicide, what will airlines do to insure someone with suicidal tendencies doesn't turn his personal problem into a massacre? What can they do?

More psychological screening and tests, offers of counselling... well - and there is always the option of reverting to a 3-person-crew and a pilot must not be left alone on the flight deck.

[phoneman]

Sosus

Shouldn't the US Navy's SOSUS system of underwater microphones be able to determine if the plane crashed into the ocean?

[Peter Kesternich]

Shouldn't the US Navy's SOSUS system of underwater microphones be able to determine if the plane crashed into the ocean?

SOSUS is only deployed in the North Atlantic and some parts of the Pacific.

[Gabriel]

More psychological screening and tests, offers of counselling... well - and there is always the option of reverting to a 3-person-crew and a pilot must not be left alone on the flight deck.

While we are at it, terminate the FDO program (Flight Deck Officer, where a pilot becomes a law enforcement officer and is permitted to carry a gun), and enable some "secure", terrorist-proof, secret way to open the cockpit door from the cabin that can override the flight crew denial.

[Peter Kesternich]

While we are at it, terminate the FDO program (Flight Deck Officer, where a pilot becomes a law enforcement officer and is permitted to carry a gun), and enable some "secure", terrorist-proof, secret way to open the cockpit door from the cabin that can override the flight crew denial.

Another option in combination with making the door penetrable again might be putting an air marshal with a pilot license on board who can open the cockpit door via thumb print or number code.

[phoneman]

SOSUS is only deployed in the North Atlantic and some parts of the Pacific.

Sound travels a very long way in the water. They still should have heard something!

[Peter Kesternich]

Sound travels a very long way in the water. They still should have heard something!

Well - if that splash was the only sound, but there is quite a bit of ship traffic in between and plenty of children throwing rocks into the sea
Naaaahh... I doubt sound travels tens of thousands of kilometers, either around the Cape of Good Hope and up the Mid-Atlantic Ridge, or through the maze of islands that is Indonesia and the Philippines to be picked up by SOSUS that is out there listening for submarines.

[Highkeas]

Can you please explain how you get to that number? (honest question)


Since the arc is the intersection between the cone and the Earth, getting a radius larger than the Earth is impossible because then both surfaces would not intersect. Hence the previous question.

The Geosynchronous satellite is 22,236 above the earth's surface. So with a 20 degree cone half angle the arc at the earth's surface is 22236 x Tan 40 = 8,093 miles. Since there are quite a few Inmarsats in GEO orbit I suspect the 40 degrees applied to some other antenna feature (maybe antenna pointed at 40 degrees but with a tighter viewing angle).

[pacoperez]

For reference:
http://www.news24.com/World/News/Mal...hting-20140319

I have good friends in Maldives and they didn't tell me anything. And I'm sure they would if that happened!

[Quench]

Hopefully the interim report released months from now will shed more clarity on this. I know Iridium makes ACARS tranceivers for the B777, although we can't know if this one had their service. Iridium uses 66 LEO satellites. They are moving pretty fast, typically overhead for about 10 minutes to any one user. Inmarsat uses geostationary satellites. Argos uses polar orbits. There's a handful of other operators but I don't know if they are in the ACARS business.

Anyway, with all these operators up there (IsatM2m, DCP, Orbcomm, Globalstar...) I am hoping one of their birds might have detected the signal as well and a record might exist. If so, perhaps they can triangulate the location of each signal and plot a real flight path.

I wonder if this is being explored.

Yesterday there was a rep from immersat on the news. The satellite that pinged the aircraft was geostationary. He also said the system was cellular so presumably that's why the give an arc as opposed to a circle. Why there Are two arcs is unclear. Supposedly the ACARS sends routine data every 30 minutes and the satellite sends an active ping if it has not received any data in 60 minutes.

As to why they only have one ping and not 8 they did not offer any explanation.

[Highkeas]

...................
As to why they only have one ping and not 8 they did not offer any explanation.

Post 890 reports that there was 6 or 7 pings. So more doubt on reported information.

[Quench]

I don't know really, but this is what I have in mind. The thick red line would be the arc and the 40° angle would be one of those two marked with thin red.

It's the lower angle 90 = directly under the satellite
0 = maximum range signal at a tangent to the surface of the earth

[Evan]

Yesterday there was a rep from immersat on the news. The satellite that pinged the aircraft was geostationary. He also said the system was cellular so presumably that's why the give an arc as opposed to a circle. Why there Are two arcs is unclear. Supposedly the ACARS sends routine data every 30 minutes and the satellite sends an active ping if it has not received any data in 60 minutes.

As to why they only have one ping and not 8 they did not offer any explanation.

We've learned since I posted that that it was an Immersat satellite receiving the signal. Iridium has only been in the ACARS business since 2007, I'm told (the Iridium advantage being range above 70° latitude), but this a/c was a 2002 build I think.

[eTang]

Filed through the last 10+ pages and still did not find too much news ... most of my questions in #589 are still unanswered. (nobody dares?) Great posting #890 by James Bond! There I also find "8:11 - INMARSAT ping received" as last ping received. Well, with the information politics so far: does this really has to be the last ping received? Maybe authorities did not yet inform us about further / later received pings? (due to investigation reasons? due to incompetence? due to 'interest'?) This last mentioned ping of 8:11 is about 7+ hours into the flight ... well, and please correct me if I am wrong - couldn't a 777, assumed that it is fully fuel loaded, flying for some 12/14 hours??? What about the range now?! Way further than we were told so far, right? How many possible airstrips (including dirt/dirty ones) does this add to the picture? How many other countries / regions?!


And what is the story behind? Why did someone deliberately changed the course of the aircraft?
- Suicide? IMHO getting more and more unlikely!
- Steal freight? AFAIK the cargo manifest hasn't been published yet, right? Small and valuable, plus well to be sold? Diamonds? (or has there been a specific piece of art transported in the aircraft?) Robbery on command! Get the freight somewhere, and then the pilot/person flying the aircraft will be taken care of after he fulfilled his job (i.e. after a soft water landing: have a speed boat ready, and leave). After a soft landing of the plane this may even involve sinking it later!
- Transport some special freight? For example nuclear material?
- Steal the aircraft for (dirty) reuse in an act of terror. This is the option I would fear the most! "just" stealing some diamonds - so what! (don't get me wrong: I pity the deeds and their families! But those masterminds behind the story do not care of another 250 souls ...=


The story so far: a perfect crime ... except for one unexpected glitch: those pings! Without those SAR would still be focussed on the sea area between Malaysia and Vietnam ... while the aircraft is thousands of thousands of kilometres away.