Southwest Airlines Nose Gear Collapse at LGA

[Joe H]

Practicing the callouts for my next career:

"Would you like fries with that?"
"Would you like to super size that?" (unless I get based in New York City, of course)
"Thank you, please come again soon..."

How did I do?

Pretty poor really

You should have added Sir or Madam or 'Undefined Gender' to your questions.
Also, of course, 'Have a nice day'

Otherwise, I think you will be ok. (back office) not serving the customer of course.
And, you might need a '3 year foundation degree' to be able to cook the chips, NOT fries, and then further training to be a 'geometrical construction supervisor' (ie : you can fold the boxes)
Otherwise, if they keep you away from the public, I think you would do really well - unless of course, the chip pan caught fire , then you might be tempted to run around the car park with it trying to get to a speed that may cause the fire to self extinguish (Because you would be thinking of your training - as in watching Memphis Belle) instead of following common sense..
Otherwise, I think you are a great candidate...
or,................. ?? you could also be a paramedic ?? - just a thought ?

[Joe H]

No, they don't penalize you for going around. What I'm saying is that a management culture of putting out a policy of a stabilized approach (probably required in the manual by the FAA) but condoning the disregard of that policy in actual practice could lead pilots to push the envelope, so to speak. Mind you, I am NOT saying that is the culture at SWA.

On the other hand, a culture that emphasizes stabilized approaches and discourages NOT going around will have the opposite effect. One way of doing this is to use peer pressure. A "FOQA of the month" (Flight Operations Quality Assurance) posting where they take de-identified information from the airplane's quick access recorder (basically a flight data recorder that is accessible by the company) and post the worst unstabilized approach for each month for all to see. This will have two effects: 1) It will bring more focus on the parameters for each gate in a stabilized approach and 2) When an approach is looking bad, the crew will think "I don't want to be on the FOQA of the month board". Another venue would be to take the most egregious unstabilized approach for a given year and present the analysis of the approach in the yearly recurrent ground school. Both these methods, preferably used together, serve to reinforce the company policy and discourage landing out of unstabilized approaches. They have a positive effect because they are done in a non-punitive way and the only people who know who made the approach are those who did it and those they tell.

Well, I am amazed
I have never read so much bullshit.!!
Do you seriously believe what you wrote here dude ? it is incredible... truly incredible. You cannot really be a pilot.. or you are so up the companies arse - or visa versa - that you write this crap. ?
You are contradicting yourself all the way through..

Start again with the : -

No, they don't penalize you for going around

And then continue from "unless of course you......" ......

[Dispatch Dog]

3 years 'university' type 'foundation' degree for a paramedic ? - roflmao..
And no, Old boy, I was NHS for over 20 years, not some cowboy outfit that tries to inflate their skill requirement levels.
For example - a 'clinical supervisor' - in an NHS control room ??? --- what ?? you check the guys n gals are reading from the computer screen correctly ? . Inflated job titles and inflated egos.
As in, Airline pilots....
Let the machines and computers do the work,
Why do you think, oh medical guru, that NHS direct finally realised that they did not need f and g grade nurses in the uk to answer the phones old man ? - simply because the computer program does it for them. So, now we don't have them in all centres, and soon to be in none. a simple call centre using the technology. ..... with possibly, some 'clinical supervisor' as a fall guy.

Pilots are still trying to cling on to their self perceived status, airlines and manufacturers need fall guys.. the public are being conned.. let the machines make the decisions and the fat dumb n happy tit behind the controls just click ' ok ' - the minute you let them take control, it all seems to go pear shaped.

Just up the coast from me - a recent train crash in the last few weeks, around 80 killed, 'driver' ('Pilot', 'Commander', 'Mechanical Interaction Supervisor') was on the mobile... a simple mistake ?? - or what ?
What do you do ? - slap him on the wrist and say, oh dear, bad boy.. we will send you back for a few hours in the sim.... or, should we lock him up and throw awat the key ?
Probably had 3 years at part time 'university' studying for a non recognised 'international' qualification....

Costa Concordia ?
The captain had massive 'experience' - should he be jailed for the disaster he caused ???
(He probably studied part time as well and got a fancy title)

The sooner we get rid of the tit in the cockpit, the better, it is only politics and scare mongering that is stopping it.
Enjoy..

So by putting up a few examples of bad piloting, you can brand every pilot a moron???

Glad I was never diagnosed by you.

I think you are judging others by your own standards and as Ustinov once said, you are "setting yourself extremely low objectives but failing to meet them"

Had some run-ins with doctors maybe? Been victimized by your boss a little too much?

As I said before, you seem to be a willing product of sensationalist media brain washing.

The truth is we are decades away from having full automation actually improve safety, and since even automated systems programming is done by humans, it will never be totally safe which I think is your ridiculous presumption.

Why are you so unwilling to discuss the actual topic?

[BoeingBobby]

Practicing the callouts for my next career:

"Would you like fries with that?"
"Would you like to super size that?" (unless I get based in New York City, of course)
"Thank you, please come again soon..."

How did I do?

O.K. I almost just choked on my morning coffee!! ROTFLMFAO!!

See if they have a job for me to SS, I only have 4 years left.

[snydersnapshots]

O.K. I almost just choked on my morning coffee!! ROTFLMFAO!!

See if they have a job for me to SS, I only have 4 years left.

You're in Bobby! I'll definitely put in a good word.

I was really hoping for something a little less strenuous, like wearing a blue vest and saying "Welcome to Wal Mart," but the bastards eliminated the greeters!

[BoeingBobby]

You're in Bobby! I'll definitely put in a good word.

I was really hoping for something a little less strenuous, like wearing a blue vest and saying "Welcome to Wal Mart," but the bastards eliminated the greeters!

Home Depot has those nice orange aprons that bring out the blue in my eyes and contrast well with the grey hair!

[Gabriel]

Latest news!!!

The the nose gear of a SW 737 collapsed while landing at LGA!!!!

(What? That's precisely the subject of this thread??? Naaaahhhhh....)

[Dispatch Dog]

While there is no new information, the threads often go off on wild tangents, which is often where I learn the most about posters' perspectives and my relative ignorance.

I just get the popcorn out and await some insight.

[snydersnapshots]

Latest news!!!

The the nose gear of a SW 737 collapsed while landing at LGA!!!!

(What? That's precisely the subject of this thread??? Naaaahhhhh....)

I talked with a mechanic last week at LGA and he said the belly skin was rippled all the way back to just forward of the air conditioning bays. At the time, Boeing people were looking at the airplane...

[snydersnapshots]

Home Depot has those nice orange aprons that bring out the blue in my eyes and contrast well with the grey hair!

Maybe Home Depot would be a good option. The guys at the penitentiary used to tell me I looked good in orange...

[BoeingBobby]

Latest news!!!

The the nose gear of a SW 737 collapsed while landing at LGA!!!!

(What? That's precisely the subject of this thread??? Naaaahhhhh....)

Sorry Gabriel, Just having a little fun, bored in my hotel room in Abu Dhabi on a 3 day layover. Still Ramadan here and not much to do!

[Highkeas]

I heard a brief report on the TV, attrubuted to NTSB, that the FO was flying the aircraft and 10-seconds before touchdown the captain took controll of the aircraft. Here is one report:

http://www.dallasnews.com/business/20130806-ntsb-captain-took-over-southwest-flight-just-before-landing-at-new-york-laguardia.ece

Is this an unusual switch (unless due to an emergency)?

[Gabriel]

What????

Let's wait and see what the pros have to say here, but my feeling is that if the NFP is going to take over the controls from the FP 10 seconds before touchdown, then it should be ONLY to enforce a go-around.

[BoeingBobby]

What????

Let's wait and see what the pros have to say here, but my feeling is that if the NFP is going to take over the controls from the FP 10 seconds before touchdown, then it should be ONLY to enforce a go-around.

Not necessarily Gabriel, if the Captain felt that the F/O was not flaring or that the winds were beyond his/her limits.

[Gabriel]

Not necessarily Gabriel, if the Captain felt that the F/O was not flaring or that the winds were beyond his/her limits.

You mean like what my instructor did many times with me for bending-avoidance?

Ok, so we have:

1- A flare, followed by a pitch down, and the airplane touching down in a 3° nose-down pitch.
2- 11 knots of tailwind at 1000ft, 11 knots of headwind at zero feet. This is at least a wind gradient, but likely some windshear too since in typical wind gradients the wind speed diminishes with altitude (due to drag with the ground) but it doesn't reverse.
3- A take-over "at some point below 400ft" (anything from 399 to zero qualifies) and about 10 seconds before touchdown (which puts the plane in the ballpark of 50 / 100 ft).

Would you care (or anybody) care to speculate?