Originally posted by Evan
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Germanwings A320 on BCN-DUS flight crash near Nice, France
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Originally posted by ATLcrew View PostNo.
--- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
--- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---
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Originally posted by Evan View PostI wonder whether this should have been noticeable to the captain while he was outside the cockpit. The flight path remains fairly even due to the energy at idle thrust, but would returning the selection to the proper one after a full minute result in thrust increase or just pitch increase?
Actually it wouldn't surprise me if the system applied some "smoothing" to the altitude target, to prevent abrupt changes in pitch when the setting is changed.Be alert! America needs more lerts.
Eric Law
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Originally posted by sjwk View Post
Note how he was playing with the target altitude all the time but set the final altitude (and left it there) shortly before the captain re-entered the cockpit.
This must have been an authorized descent. Either requested (and cleared) by the crew or instructed by the ATC.
No way the captain could have noted anything strange while out of the cockpit, beyond a normal descent, which would not have been unlikely if they were close to the point where they would start the descent anyway. Perhaps they even discussed the descent before the captain left the cockpit (note that the descent started some 20 seconds after the captain left the cockpit).
--- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
--- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---
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Wait a second... why is the captain leaving the cockpit just before the start of a descent? Shouldn't he be taking care of nature's call before departing level flight? In this scenario, he reenters the cockpit to find the a/c in level flight but at 12,000 ft lower altitude. Certainly he would have noticed this so he must have approved of it. Is it SOP to leave the rookie F/O alone on the flight deck at the start of a descent? It shouldn't be...
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Originally posted by Evan View PostWait a second... why is the captain leaving the cockpit just before the start of a descent? Shouldn't he be taking care of nature's call before departing level flight? In this scenario, he reenters the cockpit to find the a/c in level flight but at 12,000 ft lower altitude. Certainly he would have noticed this so he must have approved of it. Is it SOP to leave the rookie F/O alone on the flight deck at the start of a descent? It shouldn't be...
Scenario 1:
ATC calls for descent earlier than expected. Captain says "start the descent, I want to go to the toilet before we are lower and the workload increases". A descent from cruise is very easy and the risks are minimal. Take into account, for example, that sterile cockpit starts at 10K feet AGL.
Scenario 2:
Captain leaves cockpit 10 minutes before the planned start of the descent so he is relieved before it. ATC calls "Germanwings XYZ descend to FL240".
If copilots are instructed to descend while their captain is in the toilet, they don't tell ATC "wait until my captain is back from the restroom".
Scenario 2b: After the captain leaves the FO calls ATC "request descent to 240". If they say no, ok he stays up there. If they say yes, then it's time to play and when the captain is back the FO tells him "ATC told me to descend". In either way, the captain will never know that the FO called the ATC and requested the descent.
--- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
--- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---
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...I am thinking the word choice does not match what the co-pilot was thinking.
I think I know how to dial in 100 ft MSL to an autopilot- I object to the suggestion that he was 'practicing'.
More likely it was some sort of sicko-psycological 'reharsal'-meditation-pondering...and not any sort of sign that someone should have caught, nor would it be effective for the flight computer to call the company psychologist when such things are detected...if there were such a system, the pilot would just make hand motions visualize 100 feet...
...pure speculation, but...Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.
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Originally posted by ATLcrew View PostSource?
In the case of this flight, it looks like mode S data is what was used: http://www.skybrary.aero/index.php/U...ltitude_by_ATC
Here's a forum post with what's claimed to be the actual data: http://forum.flightradar24.com/threa...-some-more-datBe alert! America needs more lerts.
Eric Law
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Originally posted by 3WE View Post...I am thinking the word choice does not match what the co-pilot was thinking.
I think I know how to dial in 100 ft MSL to an autopilot- I object to the suggestion that he was 'practicing'.
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Originally posted by elaw View PostADS and mode S transponders both support broadcasting / reporting of "selected altitude" and "selected heading" although I don't think it's required.
In the case of this flight, it looks like mode S data is what was used: http://www.skybrary.aero/index.php/U...ltitude_by_ATC
Here's a forum post with what's claimed to be the actual data: http://forum.flightradar24.com/threa...-some-more-dat
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Originally posted by ATLcrew View PostVery interesting. I'm yet to hear a single controller say anything to the effect "Flight XXX, I cleared you to FL 230, but I see you've selected FL210" or "your assigned heading was 215, but I see you selected 225", so I imagine the capability is not widespread.
Somehow they knew immediately after the crash that the pilot had selected 100ft.
--- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
--- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---
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